Bavarian-Board.co.uk - BMW Owners Discussion Forum Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > Technical & Model Specific Forums > BMW 3 Series
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - E30 mods?
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Forum LockedE30 mods?
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  12>
Author
Message Reverse Sort Order
  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Direct Link To This Post Topic: E30 mods?
    Posted: 09-June-2003 at 13:49

I`ll get a few owners to post here with there findings.

I would doubt the difference on the e30 would be as substantial as on the 328i car as like you sais, it was restricted highly from bmw using this method of tighter ports.

Of course changing the air flow meter as well as the air filter makes a good gain, and then you can match the ports on the inlet manifold to the head as well gaining good healthy increases.

A great upgrade making for the best (engine in job) would be to change the throttle body, match the inlet ports and change the air flow meter and filter.

This will transform the car in many respects.
Back to Top
Sponsored Links


Back to Top
Webdunk View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar
M3 GT Register

Joined: 16-October-2002
Location: Central Scotland
Status: Offline
Points: 5245 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-June-2003 at 13:30

I agree with b318isp (although I do not feel e30gumball is spamming). I think our problem here is one of context and of demonstrated results.

This mod is reputed to be particularly effective on the 328i (hence my interest on the other thread). The reason for this is the throttle body / manifold on that particularly engine was used to artificially introduce power restriction in order that the 328i fell into a particular German tax bracket. Therefore the mod you propose has the potential to realise particularly noticeable gains on a 328i.

If I am interpreting what I have read correctly, then the theory should hold on other models, but the result is unlikely to be as pronounced as on the 328i hence b318isp's healthy (IMHO) scepticism and inference that further 'breathing' mods will be required in order to fully develop any gains.

As I've said before Dyno plots would help, as would owners with this mod fitted. I looked on the forum you suggested and could see plenty of interest, but no success stories - perhaps I used the wrong search term(s)?
Back to Top
b318isp View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar

Joined: 10-October-2002
Location: Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 2057 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-June-2003 at 13:12
I understand the principles of what you are talking about and they do work with other mods but you need to substantiate the improvements on its own.
Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-June-2003 at 11:37

listen, if you have any knowledge of performance on the M20 engine and yet dont accept a throttle body mod will tield more power then i doubt anyone will ever take anything you have to say seriously my friend.

 

without the wanting to upset you in any way i have to make it clear that this mod works, AND IT WORKS WELL !!!!!!!

by opening the throttle body and fitting the larger butterfly you yield more flow of air creating a better burn of air and fuel which makes for more power.

if your still having trouble getting your head round this you can pop over to my place and i`ll fit one to your car free of charge for a trial and if you feel no difference we can do a before and after power run at my local rolling road.

if there is no gain by the throttle body i will pay you your fuel, the rolling road costs and 100 for yourself as a daily wage.

if the throttle body yield an increase you just cover your own expenses and the rolling road (around 40 for both runs)

 

is this fair ?
Back to Top
b318isp View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar

Joined: 10-October-2002
Location: Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 2057 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-June-2003 at 10:48

Sorry, I still don't accept it.

The 155mph is a gentlman's agreement and electronically done - it has nothing to do with the throttle body. We are talking about road cars not track cars too.

I am quite familiar with tuning E30's and throttle body modifications are of no benefit without other engine breathing mods such as cams & valve work and often need fueling work too.

I can't help thinking that this is spamming the board with unsubstantiated devices.
Back to Top
dlg_e30 View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie
Avatar

Joined: 24-March-2003
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 52 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-June-2003 at 09:59
Cheers, thought it made sense!
David

E30 320I SE
Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-June-2003 at 13:46

dlg_e30:

you have hit the nail on the head.

BMW are commonly known for restricting cars just to satisfy the insurance banding, you only have to look at the latest M3`s to verify this, they are limited to 155mph when we all know they will do 170mph all day long !!

 
Back to Top
dlg_e30 View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie
Avatar

Joined: 24-March-2003
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 52 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-June-2003 at 13:25
This makes perfect sense i cant understand why people are questioning this? In sportscar racing the cars are some times fitted with restrictors to limit the power available, all these do is limit the amountof  air the engine can get, so by opening up the throttle housing i would imagine you would get better air flow.
David

E30 320I SE
Back to Top
graham325isport View Drop Down
Really Senior Member I
Really Senior Member I


Joined: 15-April-2003
Location: Sunderland . United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 286 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-June-2003 at 10:17

Omi, I've got a set of 15inch BBs cross spoke for sale off my 325 Sport, They are in very good condition with good tyres (Michelin) Email me if your interested.

Cheers mate

Turnyg@aol.com
E60 M5 Silver Grey










<
Back to Top
Omi318is View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie
Avatar

Joined: 28-April-2003
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 77 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-June-2003 at 00:41

Thought I might squeeze this in the Mods topic...

Need new pads, the light's been flashing on the dash for a day or two now. - What do we recommend for good hot and cold stopping power? Just for road use (occasionally quite quick road use) but something that will last a track day as well?

Also tyre recommendations, as I can't afford the rims I want at the minute I'll have to replace the 14"ers...

Car as below. :) Cheers!
Back to Top
nickp View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie
Avatar

Joined: 12-December-2002
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 34 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-June-2003 at 22:56

Looking forward to hearing the results Rhys.

Just got myself a new car..

'88 325ise auto

Will be making a few mods once i have a bit of cosmetic work done.

Going to lower(a little), some new wheels(maybe 17's), and possibly a chip. Not sure if i'm going to need a brake upgrade though with the chip.

Good luck with the fitting!!!
Back to Top
Rhys View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar
Coffee addict...

Joined: 02-February-2003
Location: from the Latin locātiō
Status: Offline
Points: 10053 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-June-2003 at 17:40
Got the chip today, will be fitting over the weekend. Will keep you posted of results.
V reg Rustbucket Merc C220 Cdi estate
J Reg Saab 900i 16v
'63 Ford Anglia 105e deluxe
R reg Honda PC50 moped..

No BMW as yet...
Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-June-2003 at 15:43

well, if i cant convince you there is no point in me trying :)

they do work and they work very well, this is something that has been used on the VW`s for years in the aftermarket scene as well as many other ranges of vehicles.

if you care to pop over to birmingham some time i will take you out in a before and after test on my very own car.

 
Back to Top
b318isp View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar

Joined: 10-October-2002
Location: Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 2057 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-June-2003 at 14:35

The narrowest point is the inlet ports though (and the inlet headers on some cars). Strictly speaking, the greatest restriction is the throttle butterflies - but I guess you are only referring to Wide Open Throttle situations.

I cannot see it working at mid revs either - at 3000rpm the engine is consuming around half the air at 6000rpm.
Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-June-2003 at 13:34

This is quite simple.

if you imagine the throttle body having an outer edge of which the pipe works clamps onto,

this means the pipework is larger than the inlet side of the throttle body.

by boring out the throttle body you are actually making the smallest point in the chain (throttle body internal) larger therefor allowing a larger amount of air into the car.

i have never stated that this would make a difference at anything like tickover but when your at say 3000rpm and in 4th gear and want to overtake you will accelerate much more quickly and with a far superior responce.

i have no figures as stated above but if your in any doubt i am willing to get some done (this is on the cards now anyway)

Like i have also mentioned above, if you fit one of my throttle bodies and dont feel a good improvement i will refund your full costs.

who else offers this type of deal ?

 

 
Back to Top
b318isp View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar

Joined: 10-October-2002
Location: Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 2057 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-June-2003 at 10:20

I still don't see how opening the throttle body increases air flow by 17%.

Airflow is only a problem at high revs and a WOT so you modification will have no effect below that. Many BMW's run lean anyway at high rpm so more fuel is needed - not air.

What about the restrictions across the air filter, pipework, headers, inlet ports and combustion chambers.

Can you post evidance of the 17% improvement.

Why did BMW not bore out the throttle body if its so simple?
Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-June-2003 at 19:45

Rhys, just make sure you let people know how good these are :)

It will transform the lax way the auto`s run i swear !!
Back to Top
Rhys View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar
Coffee addict...

Joined: 02-February-2003
Location: from the Latin locātiō
Status: Offline
Points: 10053 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-June-2003 at 18:20
Just waiting for Mr postman to deliver it, along with the alpina chip. I'm itching to find out the difference as I wouldn't have done any mods like this until I read your post on upgrades.
V reg Rustbucket Merc C220 Cdi estate
J Reg Saab 900i 16v
'63 Ford Anglia 105e deluxe
R reg Honda PC50 moped..

No BMW as yet...
Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-June-2003 at 14:33

The throttle body is opened up and machined to flow a 17% better air flow over the standard unit.

If you were to look at a standard body next to a modded one you will see just how different they are.

the walla on a standard body ar around 4mm thick !
Back to Top
b318isp View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar

Joined: 10-October-2002
Location: Ireland
Status: Offline
Points: 2057 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-June-2003 at 13:23

Please explain how a throttle body upgrade gives 17% better airflow and massive mid range power gains.
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  12>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down



This page was generated in 0.156 seconds.