BIG Brother Has arrived--NOW |
Post Reply | Page <1 23456 8> |
Author | |||||
spokey
Bavarian-Board Contributor Offensive and obnoxious tub of lard Joined: 02-March-2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1948 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 13:48 | ||||
Yeah, like thoughtcrimes. |
|||||
Ciao,
Spokey |
|||||
Sponsored Links | |||||
livvy
Really Senior Member II Joined: 12-November-2005 Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 13:55 | ||||
Software for that is still about 14 days away from successful development isn't it ? |
|||||
My views expressed are just that.
Mine & mine alone. |
|||||
scarface
Really Senior Member I Joined: 16-June-2004 Location: Surrey, UK Status: Offline Points: 414 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 15:43 | ||||
I don't see why no one thinks about the fatal flaw in this, change the number plate and you go undetected. Worse still the finger of suspicion could be pointed someone elses way.
Identity/number plate theft is on the rise.. Try and identify a criminal and he will find a way to go undetected, eventually the only thing ANPRs will be used for is keeping tabs on normal citizens. The government can always change their mind on the use of a piece of technology once it's in place, people shouldn't be so trusting. |
|||||
livvy
Really Senior Member II Joined: 12-November-2005 Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 15:59 | ||||
You think the anomaly of two cars running around on the same plates at different ends of the country won't sound an alarm on the system quickly ? The vehicles will then be stopped & the one in the "rung" car dealt with. I for one would be glad that the camera would show the Police that someone else is running around on my plate number & help them catch them. that's one of the benefits of the system not one of the problems. Edited by livvy |
|||||
My views expressed are just that.
Mine & mine alone. |
|||||
spokey
Bavarian-Board Contributor Offensive and obnoxious tub of lard Joined: 02-March-2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1948 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 16:06 | ||||
And time of the driver of the "un-rung" car will be wasted.
I for one would prefer my privacy and also not encourage the habit of "ringing" cars. This kind of fascist monitoring of the unwashed masses is going to create an awful lot of this kind of behaviour. I can see entire divisions of bureaucracy gone mad, where law-abiding citizens spend days every year proving that their car is their car, because Crapita have made a pig's ear of yet another government contract, and accused every motor vehicle driver of something nefarious. This whole thing has so many bad things going for it, I can't believe people are still standing up for it. |
|||||
Ciao,
Spokey |
|||||
Nigel
Moderator Group Joined: 09-November-2002 Status: Offline Points: 6941 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 16:22 | ||||
He does have a valid point here Livvy, the press was full of stories regarding the congestion charging zone down your way, people from all over the country were getting grief, and the ownus seemed to be on the part of the plate owner, the authorities were behaving very badly.
|
|||||
Best Wishes
Nigel |
|||||
livvy
Really Senior Member II Joined: 12-November-2005 Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 16:51 | ||||
But that is my point, ringing is here with us already & it is causing a lot of problems & wasted time for both the Police & the innocent victims of it. Far more of the innocent victims time is currently wasted with sorting out that mess than it will be in the future. With a network of cameras the authorities are likely to be aware of the fact that there are two cars running around on the your plate number before you start receiving all the fines. The system will also be providing supporting evidence for you of that fact (if it isn't picked up immeadiately) through search facilities on the movements of cars. Which will mean the authorities will have far less of a "they all say that there's another car running around with my reg number" attitude, because there will be evidence to support that. If there is a bank robber running around on your plate, is the first you want to know of it when the Police turn up to deal with you for armed robbery at your house ? Rudely awakened by an armed team perhaps ? Do you want to phone the office from the Police station & say you won't be in today because the Police are questioning you about a few armed robberies ? Or would you rather the Police already be aware that there are two cars running on that plate at opposing ends of the country & the offences aren't happening where the registered keepers (your) car is ? Edited by livvy |
|||||
My views expressed are just that.
Mine & mine alone. |
|||||
spokey
Bavarian-Board Contributor Offensive and obnoxious tub of lard Joined: 02-March-2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1948 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 17:35 | ||||
It's a great pity that your idealistic perspective is greatly undermined by the recent case of a scamera partnership sending out a fine without checking the photo beforehand. Or all the cases where policemen were involved and CCTV footage mysteriously disappeared. Precisely because of this ANPR system, I predict the following: 1. "Ringing" will become far more prevalent. 2. Policing standards will remain at their current levels. 3. More innocent people than ever before will be woken up by armed police bashing down their front door looking for Slasher McGurk and his cohorts. More innocent people than ever before will be making that call to the office, because the police will not bother to check things out. |
|||||
Ciao,
Spokey |
|||||
thepits
Moderator Group Joined: 09-July-2003 Location: far far away Status: Offline Points: 10000473 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 17:44 | ||||
Spokey - stop rising to their bait - just join our club |
|||||
Cats know your every thought.
But don't care. |
|||||
spokey
Bavarian-Board Contributor Offensive and obnoxious tub of lard Joined: 02-March-2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1948 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 17:52 | ||||
Edmund Burke wrote: "All that is necessary for evil to succeed is that good men do nothing."
|
|||||
Ciao,
Spokey |
|||||
thepits
Moderator Group Joined: 09-July-2003 Location: far far away Status: Offline Points: 10000473 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 17:57 | ||||
very profound! http://cunningrealist.blogspot.com/
|
|||||
Cats know your every thought.
But don't care. |
|||||
livvy
Really Senior Member II Joined: 12-November-2005 Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 18:05 | ||||
How does that equate to this ? One is a fairly automated process for SCPs for the absolute offence of speeding. One which I agree with you though, photos should be manually checked before sending out. The other will flag up information for action by Police officers, or provide them with information in current investigations. Not absolute offences. I doubt whether a Police officer has anything to do with the production & sending out of NIPs in SCPs.
What are the cases that you know for a fact that has happened in ? Or are we talking tabloid allegations ? The same tabloids who "in the absence of official revelations" surrounding the "de Menzies" shooting introduced their own lurid version of events that changed daily ?
It's already widespread, ANPR offers a good opportunity to provide evidence of it & locate offenders.
ANPR will incresae detections & arrests as they have for officers arrest rates in London.
As I've said ANPR will make this less likely because of the increased intelligence on vehicles. Not having that info makes what you describe more likely because Police will not be aware initially of the rung vehicles. Edited by livvy |
|||||
My views expressed are just that.
Mine & mine alone. |
|||||
livvy
Really Senior Member II Joined: 12-November-2005 Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 18:06 | ||||
Exactly.........if good men don't introduce ANPR evil will succeed. |
|||||
My views expressed are just that.
Mine & mine alone. |
|||||
thepits
Moderator Group Joined: 09-July-2003 Location: far far away Status: Offline Points: 10000473 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 18:09 | ||||
Cats know your every thought.
But don't care. |
|||||
spokey
Bavarian-Board Contributor Offensive and obnoxious tub of lard Joined: 02-March-2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1948 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 19:03 | ||||
Livvy, please don't insult my intelligence. This lazy policing of the masses by ubiquitous cameras IS the evil. I don't for one minute feel safer because of the large numbers of CCTV cameras out there, by the time someone has taken a cursory glance at their imagery, I'll be dead. I don't for one minute believe that scameras improve road safety. And based on a lifetime in IT, I don't believe for even a second that there will not be enormous, life-destroying c0ck-ups as a consequence of this blanket ANPR coverage and increased police reliance on it. It frightens me that people just accept, unquestioningly, the official line "trust us, this will be good for you." These things that are being taken from us are what the terrorists want to take away from us. And even if we killed every single terrorist of every kind in the world tomorrow, those freedoms would not come back. They are gone forever, and their removal has not won us anything. Edited by spokey |
|||||
Ciao,
Spokey |
|||||
livvy
Really Senior Member II Joined: 12-November-2005 Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 19:11 | ||||
I really don't see what is being taken away from you.
Your freedom ? Can you still not move around freely ? Who is going to be stopping you moving around less freely than you are now ? The system is monitoring vehicle movements to identify the criminal element. It sorts the wheat from the chaff. Why oh why do you really think that suddenly the Police will be after you if you are doing no wrong ? Are there not enough people breaking the law already for them to deal with ? Edited by livvy |
|||||
My views expressed are just that.
Mine & mine alone. |
|||||
Nigel
Moderator Group Joined: 09-November-2002 Status: Offline Points: 6941 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 19:24 | ||||
But they don't Livvy, they spend far too much time playing the governments target games. |
|||||
Best Wishes
Nigel |
|||||
spokey
Bavarian-Board Contributor Offensive and obnoxious tub of lard Joined: 02-March-2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1948 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 19:28 | ||||
The freedom that they are taking is the following: they are removing my
freedom to drive around the country without being spied on.
They may not feel the urge to do anything with it today, but what could
happen tomorrow? And it's all there on a plate for the taking.
Because they said so. In the article in the Independent, they clearly expressed the view that they would be interested in vehicles merely travelling in the same direction, at the same time as known "dodgy" vehicles. Can you swear, hand on heart, that you've never heard of a copper shipping information out to the criminal element? Here's a MASSIVE amount of information about people's movements that could be extremely valuable to organised crime. One CD later, and vast quantities of people who live routine lives will be at the mercy of who knows what? And in any event: the police have no business recording my movements. The police are recording the movements of ALL vehicles for a period of two years. The system hasn't even gone live yet, and they're already increasing that to FIVE years. Why would they want to keep so much information for so long? |
|||||
Ciao,
Spokey |
|||||
livvy
Really Senior Member II Joined: 12-November-2005 Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 19:38 | ||||
What target games are they ? |
|||||
My views expressed are just that.
Mine & mine alone. |
|||||
livvy
Really Senior Member II Joined: 12-November-2005 Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Posted: 28-December-2005 at 19:50 | ||||
But as I've said that is nothing new, they can follow you around now there is nothing to stop them. It could even be on a camera in the car.
We've covered that one already. We aren't talking a car that just happened to be on the same bit of motorway for 10 mins. We are talking cars actually travelling together, door to door journey type together where one is know to be concerned in crime. If the Police saw that now I would expect they would stop both cars & investigate (again pre cameras).
Yes I have to admit that bad apples selling information to criminals is not beyond the realms of possibility & has happened. But I doubt the cameras would give much new information of value to the criminal fraternity over what the bad apples could sell. The info would be of far more value to the Police. Anyone caught selling such information would of course be dealt with very severely & the instances that I have heard with it are extremely rare.
It's probably in line with their retention of information policies on a lot of other things & for the value in depth of search it offers. |
|||||
My views expressed are just that.
Mine & mine alone. |
|||||
Post Reply | Page <1 23456 8> |
|
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |