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stevesingo View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-March-2005 at 06:08
Uwe,

There is no difference in the running on my car between the 95 map with 95 fuel and the 98 map with 98 fuel. It rus exactly the same,

The maps are conservative as standard and running 95 on the 98 map seems to bring the ignition timing closer to the optimum. I have pulled aplug after a sustained highspeed run and the colour seemed fine, indicating the cylinder tempretures are normal.

I have some litreture at home regarding the relationship between C/R and Fuel octane and it makes interesting reading. It suggests that only high compression and F/I engines benefit from the higher octane. There are dyno tests that prove that some engines of more moderate C/R loose out when using higher octane fuel.

It won't matter soon any way as I'm ordering the MOTEC Kit next week

Steve
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-March-2005 at 06:56
Steve,
it's entirely up to you how you run your car. As you can't really floor your car for a longer time over here, and that includes track day's (how long are you on full throttle on a traack, 20 sec?), it might not blow your engine up in a few weeks. If you dare it then that's your choice. i simply won't.
And since we are runnig lead free, you can't really judge by reading the colour of the plug.
And a 10.5 CR is low compression to you?
E61 520d, slow and buzzy but my wallet likes the mpg.....
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-March-2005 at 07:08
Uwe, 10.2 on the Sport Evo I think. My old Civic Type R ran on 95 even with 11:1 C/R. It did run better on 98 but I would expect that as it had a knock sensor.

A lot depends on the combustion chamber shape and I believe the S14 to be quite good in this respect, allowing for an even burn.

When I get home I'll look through my books and find the artical let you know the details.

Steve

After I've fitted and mapped the MoTeC of course
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Mike 90 M3 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-March-2005 at 10:00

Originally posted by stevesingo stevesingo wrote:

Uwe,

There is no difference in the running on my car between the 95 map with 95 fuel and the 98 map with 98 fuel. It rus exactly the same,

The maps are conservative as standard and running 95 on the 98 map seems to bring the ignition timing closer to the optimum. I have pulled aplug after a sustained highspeed run and the colour seemed fine, indicating the cylinder tempretures are normal.

I have some litreture at home regarding the relationship between C/R and Fuel octane and it makes interesting reading. It suggests that only high compression and F/I engines benefit from the higher octane. There are dyno tests that prove that some engines of more moderate C/R loose out when using higher octane fuel.

It won't matter soon any way as I'm ordering the MOTEC Kit next week

Steve

I can notice a difference between the two maps, it is quite subtle though. It's mainly the mid range that's improved.

As far as i understand it, the octane rating of the fuel makes no difference to the perfomance of an engine on its own. It merely allows you to advance the ingition or increase the comp ratio without detonation. And its these changes to the engine that give the power. Obviously with modern knock sensors allowing the engine to advance its own ignition, it can seem like its the fuel that makes the difference.

I have also heard that higher octane fuels can actually reduce the power of an engine, if used alone.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-March-2005 at 10:46
Your spot on there Mike!

As for the difference between the S14 95 and 98 MAPs, I would but a weeks wages on an ignition re-map for 95 not being more than 2 degrees different to the standard 98 MAP. Where's ChippedUKBRO?

Steve

Edited by stevesingo
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kevin View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-March-2005 at 11:33
Originally posted by Simon325i sport Simon325i sport wrote:

I'm also looking for a new lower airbox section, as mine is broken, and I need the later type.

Weird really as I was only checking on the ETK on the weekend, and it will not show the part number for the lower section on it's own, so Uwe, it looks like what you've heard is right!

I needed a new lower airbox after I discovered a PO had cut a great big hole in it. The p/n is 13.71.1.312.330.

Uwe - I still have the "modified" one waiting for when we next meet.

Cheers

 
Kevin
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-March-2005 at 11:47

[/QUOTE]I needed a new lower airbox after I discovered a PO had cut a great big hole in it. The p/n is 13.71.1.312.330.



[/QUOTE]

That sounds good. Why didn`t BMW know what they were doing when they spent there mucho £££££££ on development work on these cars. I mean someone, probably with no engineering background digs out his drill, puts a nice big whole in the side of the airbox and voila - modified for more power........ OR NOT .

Was it just a round hole? I heard that cutting a shape like a "meat and two veg" adds even more power!!!!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-March-2005 at 12:03
Here is a photo of the old lower airbox........it wasn't a simple get the  drill out job. It is a bit of a mystery but the car is a lot better with the correct item fitted.

 
Kevin
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M3Nally View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-March-2005 at 14:40
Uwe,

I was always under the impression that the Evo2 had 48mm TB's, cos I thought I read it somewhere.

I took my car up to German cars today to get the valves and Tb's done (tomorrow) and was chatting to Wayne who has alot of experience in racing, buying and selling and S14 mechanics and he said yes the Evo2 came with 48mm TB's, however has found quite a few evo2 with 46mm TB's because the bigger ones had been nicked and replaced with 46mm ones .

I will ask him to have a look at mine tomorrow if they get the chance to see how big they are.

Kevin
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-March-2005 at 17:47
Evo2's do come with 46mm Throttles. Period.
The airhorns do have a second embossed ring casted if you want to cut them in length. I have the BMW press release printed in my folder.
E61 520d, slow and buzzy but my wallet likes the mpg.....
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-March-2005 at 03:48
Uwe, Could I have a copy of that for my file?

Much obliged

Kevin
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-March-2005 at 05:04
you can look it up on s14motorsport.de in "ARCHIV"


TRY HERE

Edited by UweM3
E61 520d, slow and buzzy but my wallet likes the mpg.....
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-March-2005 at 06:26
Brilliant Uwe,

Unfortunately my O level German (showing my age) didn't cover engineering technical terms, so I will have to see what a laugh I get from babelfish!

Have a good weekend all, don't go mad with the good weather.

Kevin
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-March-2005 at 07:06
The Evo 2 does use 46mm TB's, but they are made from the same casting that the 48 mm TB's are make from.

The standard 46 mm TB's use a smaller casting. You can get these machined to take 48 mm butterflies, but there isn't enough meat in the casting to get the throat area
(the part that bolts to the head)out to the same dimensions as the stock 48 mm TB's.

You can read about this on Gustave site.

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Darren M View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-March-2005 at 07:33
So when do the 48`s become more important? Are they a straight bolt on for an Evo 2, as the ports are bigger anyway?
I would assume that as the Evo 2 model had many upgrades to allow the race cars to run with these pieces and the 46`s were still retained, the 46`s must be good enough for big HP anyway. Finally in late 1989, 48`s were used on the road cars.


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-March-2005 at 08:22
Having been brought up on gold old carbs rather than injection there's one consideration that occurs to me that is often missed when folk get in to the nitty gritty re throttle bodies

Larger throttle bodies mean that the engine can breathe more air

But that extra air must flow faster because there's a limit to the amount of fuel a certain amount of air can carry at certain speeds

to get the benefit of better breathing capacity the engine must be able to rev faster to keep the speed of the incoming mixture high

that's just what you want for a high revving machine with a peaky power band but can be very boring on a road car

we all know that modern injection, engine management and so forth mean that these compromises can be engineered out to a certain extent, and I am the last one to doubt BMW's ability to get it right on these fabulous cars - but remember they are quite highly tuned as standard

the point i think it worth making is that the smaller throttle bodies aren't sub optimum unless you have specific tuning in mind

the comics we all read i think are responsible for making us all feel that like an airfix kit we should try to assemble all the right bits without thinking of the overall package

i would only worry about bigger throttle bodies if i was going to do motorsport...and that doesn't include trackdays (because the lack of an extra 25bhp wouldn't ruin my day since the clock isn't running)

then again if i had the choice between a later car and an early one i'd go for the later one for the bigger throttle bodies

have i just argued myself into a corner??

Edited by Jonners
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