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Points: 1148 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 06:30

Originally posted by Von Paulus Von Paulus wrote:

So Rover make cars that people don't want eh?

One of the most fashionable cars to have in
Hamburg (Germany's wealthiest city) is a Rover 75
Estate. Classy, subtle, well finished and BRITISH!!

it looks like the uk marketing side of rover have it wrong here .but right in germany

its a bit like that ussr company FSO and yugo of some years ago..they sold here in the 80s    .but only for us brits to wake up and say no to cheap forign imports ..perhaps hamburgs wealithest may go that way too.

austin allegro ..anybody????
its a dogs world out there
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Points: 6484 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 07:21

Originally posted by spokey spokey wrote:

Yeah, the corporate website, that well-known impartial source of good information. According to my company's website, I work in paradise. I find the reality slightly less appealing.

Ok so don't look at the website then, but I gaurantee if you do an internet search you will find lots of impartial information that does indead back up what I have said.

To date John Huntsman has put about 80% of the companies profits back into local comunities and charitable work including the Huntsman cancer institiute in the states. He has managed this while still being at the head of one of the most successful Petrochemical companies in the world today.

 He used to work for DOW but left to start his own company. He told them that the next time they'd meet he would be a major competitior. They laughed at him. 20 years later they weren't laughing.....

Shortly after Huntsman moved to our area the local news ran a program about him titled 'The best boss in the world'

Recently they have anounced the building of a new plant on the Wilton site, the first one in years.

The region is very thankful that at least the Americans know how to run a business, unlike us it would seam.

 

 
Entering an age of Austerity and now driving a Focus Diesel.
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Points: 1948 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 07:53
Originally posted by Von Paulus Von Paulus wrote:

So Rover make cars that people don't want eh?


Well, they don't make cars I'd even look at. And as to Hamburgers and their taste in cars, well, we all know about that German sense of humour!
Ciao,
Spokey

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Points: 6484 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 08:00

Originally posted by spokey spokey wrote:

Originally posted by Von Paulus Von Paulus wrote:

So Rover make cars that people don't want eh?


Well, they don't make cars I'd even look at. And as to Hamburgers and their taste in cars, well, we all know about that German sense of humour!

I'm not a big fan of Rovers but I do like the MG ZT V8, despite the fact I think the developement money would have been better spent elsewhere........

 
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Points: 1948 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 08:00
Originally posted by Peter Fenwick Peter Fenwick wrote:

To date John Huntsman has put about 80% of the companies profits back into local comunities and charitable work including the Huntsman cancer institiute in the states. He has managed this while still being at the head of one of the most successful Petrochemical companies in the world today.



That's nice. But look at his emphasis: he gives back 80% of his PROFITS -- so his first priority is to make the business stand on its own two feet, not to worry about social responsibility. Once that is done and dusted, then he worries about other stuff.

And giving money to charity doesn't make you a nice person, by the way: Bill Gates donates billions (with a "b") of dollars to charity, and he's really a thieving robber baron at heart. He just has more money than anyone could spend, so he makes himself look good by giving money away. He got all that money by being incredibly ruthless and unpleasant in the first place.

It's relatively easy to be generous when you don't need to worry about the mortgage payment.
Ciao,
Spokey

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Points: 6484 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 08:13

I appreciate what you are saying spokey, but trust me John Huntsman is a good guy. I've met him on several occasions. 

Of course he needs to make his business work first and foremost, but the reason he went into business for himself in the first place was not to make money, it was to generate the funds to help find the cure of cancer which has stricken his family.

To compare John Huntsman with Bill gates is like comparing Joseph Stalin to Margaret Thatcher.

 
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Points: 1948 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 08:42
Originally posted by Peter Fenwick Peter Fenwick wrote:

To compare John Huntsman with Bill gates is like comparing Joseph Stalin to Margaret Thatcher.


Lovely ambivalence!
Ciao,
Spokey

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Points: 6484 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 09:39

It perhaps wasn't the best comparison. Mind you just because I didn't like Thatcher doesn't mean I don't think she was a strong and successful leader, just like Stalin. My point was that although in one respect the two were the same they were actually very different people.

While I didn't like Maggie, I respected her. I couldn't say the same for Howard.

You will always find no end of people who don't like, even hate Bill Gates. However I bet you'd find it a lot harder to find anyone who has a bad word to say against Jon Huntsman.

Like I said see for yourself, do an internet search.

 
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Points: 927 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 11:55
On the subject of going Bankrupt etc..... There was a car company that had run out of money, nobody was interested in realy saving at the time, the then government wanted to sell it to a rival manufacturer but it was bought & kept independant & look at it now
Das Wolperdinger

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Points: 118 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 13:49
Originally posted by spokey spokey wrote:

that German sense of humour!


What, like the BMW Z1? Only the Brits would be daft
enough to buy that............likewise the 2CV!


to add to this, there are no current model BMW's that
I'd want to buy. Nothing shouts "BUY ME" to me I'm
afraid. Rather have an Audi to be honest.

Today we took in a 1998 Rover 200Vi (the roundy
shaped one), 124'000 miles, that metallic purple
colour and still looking and driving okay. Nothing
wrong with it at all. So why are Rovers rubbish?
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Points: 1148 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 14:08

Originally posted by Von Paulus Von Paulus wrote:

  

Today we took in a 1998 Rover 200Vi (the roundy
shaped one), 124'000 miles, that metallic purple
colour and still looking and driving okay. Nothing
wrong with it at all. So why are Rovers rubbish?

i have to agree...but lets face it ..who you going to knock it on too???????.. i think you know the answer to that one

 
its a dogs world out there
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Points: 1212 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 15:27
Yes, but such an argument could be applied if he said "Took in a 1998 anonymous hatchback with 124k on the clock". Just because it's an older Rover shouldn't automatically prejudice you against it - I've driven a few of these cars and they are much better than most of their cars in the class at the time. Yes they are hopelessly outdated now, but BMW raided the Rover piggy bank and headed back to Munich with all the money and development ideas, plus MINI, Land Rover and everything else worth taking. MG Rover has some fantastic engineers in the company, but sadly zero cash to allow them to do anything whilst the only profitable part of Ford is now Land Rover - imagine if that had been left with Rover? Argue all you want about the cars, but business wise BMW stripped MG Rover of all its assets and left the remains for the vultures. Step in SAIC and demand money from the government.
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Points: 1148 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 15:43

if the goverment did bail them out ..because shanghi automotive are only in talks again because of it[dont want to buy a clapped out banger]......theres then the  DTI appraisel first..and theres shanghi wanting at least a two year deal to keep there faith in the deal....

.are the DTI  willing to push the "brussel state aid rules" [anti competions]witch it would fall foul off ..in  actually sticking a two year rescue package together ..???? sorry guys  it looks like the writings on the wall ...wether you like it or not .
its a dogs world out there
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Points: 1425 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 16:24

How come Fiat/Alfa/Lancia survived the 1970s & 1980s and BL didn't?

Is it because Italy has a more socialist/interventionist Govt system to keep large enterprises afloat during the bad times?
Philip
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Points: 6381 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 16:32
Originally posted by Von Paulus Von Paulus wrote:

...Today we took in a 1998 Rover 200Vi (the roundy
shaped one), 124'000 miles, that metallic purple
colour and still looking and driving okay. Nothing
wrong with it at all. So why are Rovers rubbish?


They're not really Rovers. The one you've got is still fundamentally a rebadged Honda.....

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Points: 118 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 18:01
No it is not. It uses a K Series Rover engine and if
you take the time read the book about Rover and
BMW, you'll discover that in fact, it was a joint effort. If
anything, the Honda Civic (which never used the 200
shell, only the 5 door 400) was a Honda-ised Rover.
The Honda was built in Swindon using bodyshells
made by.........Rover.

You are thinking of the old pre 1996 Rover 200-400.
The one we have here was designed after BMW
bought Rover, a move which seriously upset Honda
and let to the demise of the 600.

One of the best bargain used cars at the moment?
The Rover 600. They're worth b*gger all but are a
damned good car. I can remember CAR magazine
comparing them very favourably with the E36 318i.

BMW pulled out because they made a total mess of
Rover. They spent far too long 'hands off' when what
they SHOULD have done is gone in there, Blitzkrieg
style, fired all the managers, installed BMW people
and kept the designers and Idea people who really
do know what they're doing. Rover's workforce are
also excellent judging by the Rovers I've seen of late.
The paint finish on a black ZT would shame BMW.

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Points: 6941 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 18:19

I'd change my old 5 series for a 75 tourer anyday, any engine, they are just so pleasent to drive, I just cant afford to at the moment.

I also like the 600's.

It is a terrible British trait to trash your own and praise the foriegn.

How many classic rovers out there ?

How many clasic bmw's ?
Best Wishes

Nigel

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Points: 1948 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 18:21
Originally posted by Von Paulus Von Paulus wrote:

BMW pulled out because they made a total mess of Rover. They spent far too long 'hands off' when what they SHOULD have done is gone in there, Blitzkrieg style, fired all the managers, installed BMW people and kept the designers and Idea people who really
do know what they're doing.


Yeah, that would have been really popular with the UK public: "BMW guts Rover and installs corporate henchmen, Rover destroyed from the inside."

BMW were always on a losing streak with Rover, there was no way that they were going to win. They should have never bought it and thrown all that money down the drain.
Ciao,
Spokey

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Points: 1212 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 18:23
My flatmate's father just bought himself a 53 plate MG ZT. It's only a 1.8 but it's nice and quick, and gives the feeling all round that it is built from a large block of granite. This thing is so well screwed together. My uncle has a C class C220D, and compared to the ZT it feels tacky and insubstantial. The people here who say MG Rover build crap have evidently never sat in one of their products, or at least not for the last fifteen years.

The 200/400 R8 from the early nineties was a promising start to the Rover revival, solidly built with the fantastic K series. 600 is a beautiful car, pick up a good one for a grand - shame. The 200/25 is a Rover designed and built car from the ground up, Honda played no part whatsoever in its construction. My mate has one and it is a fabulous little car. The 400/45 was designed with Honda's help and is based on the Civic. The 75 is completely Rover designed and built, despite rumours abounding that the car is based on an E39 floor pan. BMW played no part in the design, and the result is a competitve and good looking car, especially the latest facelift models. Yes all designs are getting on a little, dynamically they are beginning to lag behind competitors but those who argue on issues of build quality, please do MG Rover a favour. Go and drive the cars before passing judgement, and an open mind always helps.

If I was offered an E39 520i or a ZT 160, I'm afraid the MG would win every time.
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Points: 4000 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-April-2005 at 18:35

Originally posted by Philip Philip wrote:

RV8's were VERY popular in Japan I believe.

If they are so popular, why are the classifieds in the various classic mags featuring some many of them back here again?
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