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spokey 
Bavarian-Board Contributor 
Offensive and obnoxious tub of lard Joined: 02-March-2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1948 |
 Posted: 21-November-2005 at 15:39 |
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Does that include irresponsible speeding drivers? |
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Ciao,
Spokey 
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thepits
Moderator Group 
Joined: 09-July-2003 Location: far far away Status: Offline Points: 10000473 |
Posted: 21-November-2005 at 15:11 |
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Star Trekking, across the universe.................. "Uhura: There's Klingons on the starboard bow, Starship Captain, James T. Kirk Kirk: Ha-ha! We come in peace, shoot to kill, McCoy: It's worse than that, he's dead, Jim.
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Cats know your every thought.
But don't care. |
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livvy
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 12-November-2005 Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Posted: 21-November-2005 at 14:38 |
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Average number of homicides per 100,000 population 2000-2002
England & Wales 1.76 Belgium 7.06 France 1.82 Germany 1.11 EU average 2.48 USA 5.59 Estonia 10.29 Lithuania 10.39 Russia 22.25 South Africa 48.84 |
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My views expressed are just that.
Mine & mine alone. |
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Robmw
Really Senior Member I 
Joined: 29-August-2005 Location: Epping Status: Offline Points: 311 |
Posted: 21-November-2005 at 14:30 |
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I also felt like Rhys that Brazil had terrible gun crime but from the Head of the Met Commissioner Blair speech he stated some figures which I think are appalling per 100,000 head of population - in Europe there are 400 crimes per year,
in Brazil there are 900 crimes per year, in USA there are 4,000 crimes per year, & nbsp; & nbsp; & nbsp; and in UK THERE ARE 11,000 CRIMES PER YEAR Now I will appreciate that a lot of people will say that this is down to poor reporting in other countries and excellent reporting in this country, personnally I feel this country is becoming lawless and soon protection will come from vigilantism |
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Robert Born
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sleeper
Really Senior Member II
Original and STILL best Joined: 26-March-2004 Location: East Sussex/Kent border Status: Offline Points: 2098 |
Posted: 21-November-2005 at 14:27 |
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I have been over here, by 3 ARV's and a helicopter, new pants? yes please!
Anyone crossed a border into china? You can't even LOOK at the guards (who have loaded AK47's, WITH THE SAFETY OFF)! That's scary, but no matter what language, if they shout, you freeze! |
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livvy
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 12-November-2005 Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Posted: 21-November-2005 at 11:03 |
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Must be then. Just like the news said he ran, no he didn't, he ran, no he didn't. Edited by livvy |
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My views expressed are just that.
Mine & mine alone. |
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Peter Fenwick
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Joined: 27-August-2003 Location: Lost somewhere in time... Status: Offline Points: 6484 |
Posted: 21-November-2005 at 06:58 |
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Good, there are enough of them out there already.... |
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Entering an age of Austerity and now driving a Focus Diesel.
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scarface
Really Senior Member I
Joined: 16-June-2004 Location: Surrey, UK Status: Offline Points: 414 |
Posted: 21-November-2005 at 06:05 |
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TBH I can't remember who was alleging it at the time, it was on the news. So it must be true!
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livvy
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 12-November-2005 Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Posted: 21-November-2005 at 02:00 |
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Who said that ? The IPCC ? |
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scarface
Really Senior Member I
Joined: 16-June-2004 Location: Surrey, UK Status: Offline Points: 414 |
Posted: 20-November-2005 at 18:28 |
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There were delays on getting evidence, and the police were being
obstructive. For one the CCTV tapes cannot be found/were blank
from the cameras covering the incident.
I agree that the fact he was an illegal doesn't have anything to do with the shooting, unless he did run. Even then you shouldn't be shot for running from the police, it could have been you or I. All I am saying is that to be prepared to use lethal force on someone that you have no intelligence on is crazy. We will wait for the findings of the enquiry. |
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livvy
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 12-November-2005 Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Posted: 20-November-2005 at 16:28 |
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We don't know yet Nigel that he did run. We only have our press saying that he did & then saying that he didn't & then saying that he did. We will have to wait for the enquiry & IPCC investigation to publish it's findings. With a press desperate to have a story on the matter & the Police neither confirming or denying those stories, that seems like the only sensible course of action. Edited by livvy |
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Nigel
Moderator Group
Joined: 09-November-2002 Status: Offline Points: 6941 |
Posted: 20-November-2005 at 15:57 |
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I think Livvy, it may have a bearing, he ran, lets be honest, if he'd stood still and put his hands up he'd still be with us. Suicide bombers are a new threat for us, mistakes are likely no matter how regrettable, but if someone points a gun at you and shouts armed police, you must stand still. I've been removed from a car in Guatamala, at gunpoint, by police so they could search for drugs. It isn't nice, I don't speak the lingo, but I'm still alive, I may not be if I'd run ! I've been locked up by yanks on the usa/mexican border because the dopey gits can't read, but you don't resist ( and I even had the lingo in that case). |
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Best Wishes
Nigel |
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livvy
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 12-November-2005 Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Posted: 20-November-2005 at 14:05 |
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What are you alleging ?
Evidence going missing, what evidence has gone missing ? Him being an illegal immigrant has little to do with this to my mind. The terrorists in the July bombings weren't after all & he wasn't approached because of his immigration status. Edited by livvy |
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scarface
Really Senior Member I
Joined: 16-June-2004 Location: Surrey, UK Status: Offline Points: 414 |
Posted: 20-November-2005 at 13:42 |
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Jean Charles de Menezes was an illegal, granted. I have no time
for illegals. But he could have easily not been. Let us
not forget it was said that he was followed because he lived in a flat
near where one of the bombers was thought to have lived, and he looked
a bit foreign. It also emerged that he was actually not wearing
heavy clothing and didn't have a bag, so where was the bomb
conceiled? It was also found that he used a ticket to get through
the barrier, instead of the initial report that he ran, vaulting the
barrier. I take the terrorist threat very seriously being someone
that spends a lot of time on the tube, but we have to be careful.
Let's just hope that the public enquiry can come to a definite conclusion given the evidence that they have been given, it's a shame so much evidence goes missing immediately after a mistake. - Not a Daily Mail reader btw |
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livvy
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 12-November-2005 Status: Offline Points: 745 |
Posted: 20-November-2005 at 04:39 |
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Yes, any casual impartial observer of our system could see that B 7 VP is talking complete tosh. The burden of proof is clearly on the prosecution & if there are a lot of miscarriages of justice, they are that a lot of guilty people get off. Still that is part of the safeguards of the system, to try & ensure that an innocent is not wrongly convicted. It does of course still happen, but rarely. For everyone of those wrongly convicted, probably thousands of guilty walk free, in attempt to limit those other miscarriages. But if we put the blinkers on & stare at one thing, we of course lose sight of the bigger picture. Edited by livvy |
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Peter Fenwick
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Joined: 27-August-2003 Location: Lost somewhere in time... Status: Offline Points: 6484 |
Posted: 20-November-2005 at 04:05 |
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I think maybe you and B7VP should go and live in a country where they genuinely don't have any freedom. Then maybe you might be less quick to make jibes about this country. Oh and Spokey, i thought you were right wing, not liberal! |
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Entering an age of Austerity and now driving a Focus Diesel.
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Peter Fenwick
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Joined: 27-August-2003 Location: Lost somewhere in time... Status: Offline Points: 6484 |
Posted: 20-November-2005 at 03:59 |
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No I don't. Unfortunately in this day and age everything we see and here has to be considered carefully. There is so much political spin put on everything that it is hard to know what is true and what is lies. BTW I don't read any newspapers because most of them a re full of propaganda for one party or another. Sorry, I do read one paper, the Darlington & Stockton times, because my Wife writes for them I find the TV news a bit more reliable, although I accept it is also not without it's political agenda. To balance it out I watch Sky news and the BBC news
I don't worry about it. There are some miscarridges of justice sure but how many cases a put through the courts without any problems? You only here about the ones where it has gone wrong because they're the ones that get reported on. I've only ever had one direct experience of the court system and it work for me. |
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Entering an age of Austerity and now driving a Focus Diesel.
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Nigel
Moderator Group
Joined: 09-November-2002 Status: Offline Points: 6941 |
Posted: 19-November-2005 at 20:14 |
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HIs visa to stay in this country had expired, so he is an illegal immigrant ! If he doesn't understand the words " armed police stop", then tough , harsh but true. Lets not get too easy on this, he was in England, the language is English, and according to his family, he was fluent anyway. Spend some time in Countries where the police carry guns as a way of life, carry weapons yourself, things start to look different. |
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Best Wishes
Nigel |
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Rhys
Moderator Group
Coffee addict... Joined: 02-February-2003 Location: from the Latin locātiō Status: Offline Points: 10053 |
Posted: 19-November-2005 at 18:37 |
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This illegal immigrant happend to be Brazilian did he not? A country where gun crime is prolific. What about his understanding of English, could he understand what was said to him? A load of blokes with guns are running towards you, shouting.. what would you do? I'd peg it as well - I wouldn't want to hang around to see what they wanted, just like he'd probably do in Brazil. |
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V reg Rustbucket Merc C220 Cdi estate
J Reg Saab 900i 16v '63 Ford Anglia 105e deluxe R reg Honda PC50 moped.. No BMW as yet... |
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spokey
Bavarian-Board Contributor
Offensive and obnoxious tub of lard Joined: 02-March-2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1948 |
Posted: 19-November-2005 at 18:13 |
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It's funny how when people out of Westminster feel like their way of
life is threatened, they get told that the law is sufficient. However,
when the people in
Westminster feel like their way of life is threatened, they can
introduce all sorts of draconian b*ll*cks, often without understanding
the capabilities of existing laws.
Sneaky, too: introduce an outrageously draconian violation of our civil liberties, so that when it gets cut from 90 to 28 days, everyone feels like their rights have been defended, yet the police still have the right to arrest Labour Party members who dare to heckle a speaker and hold them in jail for 28 days without charge. Or arrest people who happen to look a bit foreign because they are carrying a rucksack, fingerprint them, record their DNA and screw up their lives forever with a criminal record, utterly without reason.  Let's hear it for a great, modern, liberal democracy!  |
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Ciao,
Spokey
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What type of Police service????
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livvy wrote:
