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Rapacious ![]() Newbie ![]() Joined: 21-April-2005 Status: Offline Points: 7 |
![]() Posted: 21-April-2005 at 17:46 |
Have a shake at 50mph, never really did anything about it as I was planning on buying new wheels. Have bought new wheels but the same problem exists. I want to try hubcentric rings first before the more serious stuff involving bushes and thrust arms. But Im having trouble trying to find somewhere to get them. Can someone tell me where I can get hubcentric rings from, whether mailorder or from a shop in the South East. Edited by Rapacious |
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Doive ![]() Really Senior Member II ![]() ![]() Joined: 09-February-2005 Location: Clinging to a turbine, Hexham Status: Offline Points: 1212 |
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Find yourself a friendly machine shop who can make you up a set to suit
your application. Often the ones you get mail order turn out to be
cheap pressed aluminium ones, remember these are the bits that need to
take the weight of your car! A good set of turned billet ones are the
answer, and shouldn't cost the earth. I assume these are what you mean
when you say 'hubcentric rings'?
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1987 BMW 525e Lux Auto (sadly deceased)
Get Firefox - Ditch Hopeless Inertnet Exploder www.doive.co.uk ![]() |
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Bubble ![]() Newbie ![]() ![]() Joined: 16-January-2005 Location: Cheshire Status: Offline Points: 22 |
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I've just received some hub rings that I bought off e-bay, they are listed under spigot rings. The guy was really good when I spoke to him on the phone. Euro Car Parts say they don't do them anymore. Yes, I must admit to being a little sceptical about the quality and I do think they are a bit flimsy for what they cost but, surely, when they are on the car and pressed into the wheel, they will form a tight bond onto the hub, taking up the gap which would have been evident if the rings were not used, eliminating a major imbalance issue. Bubble. |
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Brucey ![]() Really Senior Member II ![]() ![]() Joined: 07-March-2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 744 |
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actually the rings should only take small loads in use, provided the wheel bolts are fairly tight. Even plastic ones work OK for a while. What they do is to centralise the wheel correctly before the lug nuts are done up. Without this feature you will have all kinds of wobbles. cheers
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~~~~~~~ Brucey ~~~~~~ |
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pma1ums ![]() Really Senior Member II ![]() ![]() Joined: 12-October-2004 Location: central uk Status: Offline Points: 1148 |
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has anyone got a picture of these things .....???? how much do they cost?? as iam based in the enginering trade id be intrested to know about these things ...if there best for them to be precisely made rather than cnc/mass machined id like to know as i mite get some made any help guys ?? thanks in advance |
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its a dogs world out there
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Rapacious ![]() Newbie ![]() Joined: 21-April-2005 Status: Offline Points: 7 |
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Heres a link to some on ebay, these ones are aluminium and cost 27 quid, you can get plastic ones aswell which id assume are cheaper. http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category =14771&item=7968751140&rd=1 I think they seem to be called spigot rings in this country, but in the US they call em hubcentric rings, which seems more accurate. Does anyone know the physics behind the wobble problem as to why it only seems to occur at a specific speed, ie 50mph? Edited by Rapacious |
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Brucey ![]() Really Senior Member II ![]() ![]() Joined: 07-March-2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 744 |
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its resonance; the same reason a pendulum swings at a constant rate*. Any spring system with a mass attached will try and resonate, only damping will stop it. An out of balance wheel will exert a radial force of many kgs at speed, and at the correct speed it will excite a natural resonant frequency in the suspension and the result is a wobble. If the wheel is off centre by 0.2mm this would be as bad or worse than taking all the balance weights off typically..... *- or a shopping trolley castor flaps wildly...... cheers
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~~~~~~~ Brucey ~~~~~~ |
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Rapacious ![]() Newbie ![]() Joined: 21-April-2005 Status: Offline Points: 7 |
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Every days a school day, thanks Brucey, always bugged me why that was. So is the resonance buidling up in the damper or the wheel, or is it trying to rip the whole suspension off? Edited by Rapacious |
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NOISUFNOC ![]() Really Senior Member II ![]() ![]() Joined: 27-September-2004 Location: Sunny Greenock by the Sea Status: Offline Points: 1473 |
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£10 for 4 from most alloy wheel stockists
you might have to trim them with a stanley knife to make sure they fit in the shoulder on your allot wheel, but they cure all manner of shakes once fitted. Ive only ever used plastic ones because you can trim them to fit. |
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528 for now
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Brucey ![]() Really Senior Member II ![]() ![]() Joined: 07-March-2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 744 |
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the wheel can be oscillating in any plane when you have a vibration or wobble- it will vary from one car to another which is the most excitable 'mode' of oscillation. eg. with most cars its a simple up and down motion, but on E24s and E28s I think the front wheel can rotate slightly about the steering axis, using all the arm bushings etc (which are rubber) as the 'spring' part of the system; this is why these cars are such devils for this type of problem. On my E24 if I swap the front wheels for the rears, wheels which were in balance enough when fitted to the rear may cause bad vibes on the front. A wheel weighs about 70-20kg with the tyre. If it is all 0.1mm off centre this gives about 2000gmm of moment- this would be like losing a 10g balance weight off the wheel rim which is clearly bad news. And 0.1mm isn't very much, is it..... cheers
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~~~~~~~ Brucey ~~~~~~ |
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Rapacious ![]() Newbie ![]() Joined: 21-April-2005 Status: Offline Points: 7 |
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Im assuming here, but this must be a widespread problem with any after market alloy on any car where the alloy has a larger hub size to make it more compatible....so I think its a little worrying assuming the above, that when I went into BMW and described my problem the man on the service counter said it could be balancing or something more serious to do with the suspension. Went down the road to a tyre shop that the dealership recommended and had the alloys balanced (probably needlessly), this time they can actually see that non OEM alloys are fitted but there is no mention of incompatible hub sizes and the need for hubcentric/spigot rings (and this place even sells alloys so must be aware of the problem and its symptoms). Does this point at widespread ignorance of a easily fixable problem or just 'rip off Britain' But, of course, if my assumptions about how common this problem are is wrong, then ignore my ramblings |
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Rapacious ![]() Newbie ![]() Joined: 21-April-2005 Status: Offline Points: 7 |
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Finally after chasing around one saturday trying to find someone who
had the right rings, I ended up at Croydon Race and Rally, the man
there rooted through a bag of rings but didnt have the right ones, but
he did give me the number of the UK MOMO wholesaler, who sent me the
right rings the next day, fitted perfectly and resolved my problem
![]() Edited by Rapacious |
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