I know some here are interested by going this way to get a bit more out of our cars!

I was myself interested in doing it. After looking at it I found a couple of possibilities around dublin, working out @+/- 500€.

Then browsing on the forum it looks like one of our fellow member (chippeduk) as very good review for his products. I am now in contact with him. For me, he'll need to do a rolling mapping (something like this!, he need my car anyway), so I have two options:

1) I am the only one interested in ireland so I have to drive to birmingham to get it done,

2) We are few interested, we split the cost of flying him over+guinness+macdonald.

Typical cost are 50/75£ for chip and around 125£ for mapping (maybe a bit more for //Ms).

For those like me with a 2.8L M52 engine, if we add the M50 manifold/throttle body we are good for 25hp extra and 500£ less in the bank! (32€/hp )

i can get 17hp in many cases on the 2.8.

i am unsure of exact figure when added to the inlet by alpina527 but it will be noticable and impressive.

fair enough - I don't know why but I had assumed gains of about 20 or 30bhp on the 2.5 M52 with a proper chip & remap (not including manifold & TB).

@lodo - if chippeduk did come over here, when & where would you think of doing this? (remembering that it must be close to a McDonalds)!

chippeduk wrote: i guess the word has got around that i am partial to a burger :D

Yeah, I saw this on another thread!

For the hp gain i was just saying 25hp to be conservative (is that english? well you know what I mean! )

I personnaly hope to be around 230hp at the crank and >200 at the wheels.

For the planning, I would say early 2005 because we need to source M50 manifold (i think Alpina527 is out opf stock at the moment!)

For the location, I have a couple of idea in mind as I know a guy who run a truck business so he has warhouse space around athlone (yes, we also have macdonal in athlone, 2 to be precise!).

Sure Dublin would be more convenient but I don't have contacts there! ;-)

I got my 170bhp 2.5 523i remapped and gained 15 or 16bhp as per rolling road. I guess that the supersprint exhaust backbox and resinator pipe should have added another 5bhp so i'm now looking at 190bhp. I'm sure it would have to be a very special mapping job to gain more than 10% from a normally aspirated petrol engine, but then again maybe i'm wrong. I got mine done through LogicAutomotive, and was €400.

I contacted alpina527 and he is very short on m50 manifolds, so maybe a group search might be in order for donor manifolds, and perhaps we could get someone to do the job here. I've been told that with larger throttle body/m50 manifold 15/20bhp extra wouldn't be unrealistic, so perhaps that would mean 205/210bhp for my 523i. A combination of chip and manifold/throttle body should add approx 30/35bhp.

Thanks for the info!

For the manifold I will start to look for them in France (insurance being very strict in france, not many people mod their cars!), then we could ship them to alpina who could install is kit and finally we could do a group install! With few brains I am sure we can sort out any kind of problem!

You might have to reprog yours if you add the M50 manifold because by doing so you'll change your fuel mixture? maybe the ECU can adapt?

Before you try France try...

kbannon wrote: Before you try France try... Traynors Ltd Scrap Dealers Scrap Merchants 86 Armagh Road, Moy, Dungannon, Co. Tyrone, BT71 7JA Tel: 048-38891242 Fax: 048-38891611

I'll give hime a call tomorrow,

Thanks

If you find a manifold, it must be part number 1 735 730 2.5 or alternatively, 1 735 728 2.5. No other number will do. They are fitted to E36 325 and E34 525 models from 92-96. They need extensive modification, which will take about a week. The bodies are always in stock.

The part number is located under the throttle body hole.

If you have any doubt about which manifold you have, please email me on mailto:alpina527@aol.com - alpina527@aol.com or phone/text +447968391056

Make sure they aren't from the 2 litre!!

alpina527 wrote: If you find a manifold, it must be part number 1 735 730 2.5 or alternatively, 1 735 728 2.5. No other number will do. They are fitted to E36 325 and E34 525 models from 92-96. They need extensive modification, which will take about a week. The bodies are always in stock. The part number is located under the throttle body hole. If you have any doubt about which manifold you have, please email me on mailto:alpina527@aol.com - alpina527@aol.com or phone/text +447968391056 Make sure they aren't from the 2 litre!!

Thanks For the part numbers! I'll let you know if I manage to get my hand on few of them.

Iwas saying athlone because it's where I am but if we can do it around dublin no problem either!

For the 330ci, i would think it's not a chip it will need to be rolling re-map! I guess that it would be good for 14hp or so.

Ludo,

I'm strongly considering doing the same and would be on for splitting the cost of flying over chippeduk if he can sort me out too.

John

I may drive over and bring the wife and son for a weekend away.

We might try to set up a group buy for the macdonald!

Does anyone know what the difference between the M52 2.5L engine as per an e46 323ci and a 325ci. And more importantly what can be done to get the 323ci up to 193bhp or so. I had been hoping there might be a straightforward way to make the 323ci "become" a 325ci.

Anyone got any ideas?

Thanks

John

they are different engines (the 323i & 523i using the M52 [and the M52tu] and the 325i/525i used the M54

See http://www.europeancarweb.com/features/0402ec_bmwcodes/ - http://www.europeancarweb.com/features/0402ec_bmwcodes/
Your best bet is to get this throttle body and inlet manifold conversion job done.

Aaaahh - now it's all clear.

Thanks for that Killian - I'll look into it. Would you recommend getting a chip and remap too? At £125 it seems a low cost option for 8bhp

The thing is that if you do throttle body and manifold, I am not sure the stock ECU can coop with such an air flow.

If for £500 we manage to get an extra 30hp, thats sopud like a good deal to me!

I have fitted the manifold only, but am going to see chippeduk this weekend for a remap, so I could let you know how the 2.8 fairs with the remap.

The manifold alone has made a notible difference and have got used to it now. But if I want to be reminded how it restricts the engine, I just drive the gf's Z3 2.8 although this is a 99 version, so double vanos and does have a good low end pull it still runs out of puff above 5,000rpm. The engine does cope with the extra airflow from the manifold, but I'm sure a remap will help more. I have noticed the induction bark at high revs is quieter since fitting the manifold, maybe this is due to more air and running a slightly leaner mixture - I'm hoping a remap will give the bark back!!  Obviuosly only with a sports filter will it bark.

On a 2.8 with manifold and remap - 225+bhp. There are 328s on e36coupe forum with a proven 240bhp from manifold, bbtb, airfilter, remap and exhaust.

325/323 (323 with M50 manifold) should see 210+bhp.

And a good increase in mpg!!

alpina527 wrote: If you find a manifold, it must be part number 1 735 730 2.5 or alternatively, 1 735 728 2.5. No other number will do. They are fitted to E36 325 and E34 525 models from 92-96. They need extensive modification, which will take about a week. The bodies are always in stock. The part number is located under the throttle body hole. If you have any doubt about which manifold you have, please email me on mailto:alpina527@aol.com - alpina527@aol.com or phone/text +447968391056 Make sure they aren't from the 2 litre!!

Ian,

How do they differ? Wasn't there a certain amount of ribs that can be counted too?

chippedup says the remap will only give an 8bhp gain. Ludo seems to think that a remap then the manifold and throttle body might be too much for the ECU.

Dave328 reckons on 210bhp+ from the lot (sounds nice!)

Opinions / Advice anyone?

i always quote minimum gains as this way there are no comebacks or people dissapointed.

i quote 14hp on the m3 when in fact i have never seen one do less than a 20hp gain.

Dave: The correct type has 12 ribs to the left side of the throttle body, The other type has 5 ribs to the left. These are no good for my conversion. I have pictures if you need them at mailto:alpina527@aol.com - alpina527@aol.com

Any chips for the M54 engine in the 320 coupe ????? (2.2litre)

Topazman 

I should have more info on manifold on monday, so far the best price I got is 75€. Unfortunately it's a bank holiday in france, all those lazy b*****d are off until monday!

I talked to alpina527 yesterday and he told me the max price we should be paying for the manifold is £50.

I have contacted FABDirect to see if they have manifolds - i'll hear from them today.

Who's the best person to get to do the work??

fab will charge you roughly 2.5 times the price anyone else does.

but there service is second to none !

JohnH wrote: I have contacted FABDirect to see if they have manifolds - i'll hear from them today. Who's the best person to get to do the work??

I'll personnally go with alpina as he have a good reputation on the forums and I'd rather give my money to him than to some unknown. He has good price (£350 for the throttle body and manifold, as a reminder I think eurosport have a kit for nearly 1000€!) and quick turnaround (send him the manifold, it will take him a week to do the work on it!)

thats what they are refering too mate.

alpina needs them to get the manifold then ship it to him to modify.

dave 328 wrote: When did chippeduk say 8bhp?

In a PM

dave 328 wrote: 210bhp from a 2.5 is only 17bhp extra, so not impossible!!. I got an extra 6bhp just from a sports filter - RR proven.

The 323 only has 170bhp so 210 is a jump of 40bhp or nearly 25%. This still ok or gonna be too much for the car. Does an having an auto box make a difference?

On another note - anyone know what's the name of the guy with the rolling road near Enfield?

dave 328 wrote: When did chippeduk say 8bhp? This is usually the power increase on smaller engines like a 316. On the bigger engines, more extra power is to be had. Superchips quote 13bhp extra, chippeduk typically gets more than Superchips. Superchips quote an extra 40bhp for the 4.0 litre - just from a chip! 210bhp from a 2.5 is only 17bhp extra, so not impossible!!. I got an extra 6bhp just from a sports filter - RR proven. It has been proven that just taking the viscous fan off can yield an extra 6bhp, then abit more using different pulleys!

Dave,

You have to be carefull with the numbers superchip and other give. When they say 14hp gain, that's the peak gain (@ say 4200rev/min) and not gain peak (your max power all other your band, in my case 5500rev/min stock and maybe 5750 once tuned).

For the Fan delete, the gain reported I read of are around 3hp only and about the same for the pulleys (I have a set in transit at the moment!).

What kind of filter did you fit? I think I am gonna go with the ITG. They got great result on RR on mitsibishi FTO ( http://www.camskill.co.uk - www.camskill.co.uk )

If there is people interested in RR we could organise a RR day, should reduce the cost a good bit. Personnally I would like to do one after every mod to see the gains!

I f I can find a RR for 35€ for 3 consecutives run (just to have something realistic) I'll do one at eech mod step.

1)Stock

1)Cold air intake (hope to get +4 or 5hp)

2) CAI + pulleys + lightweight flywheel (12pounds + M5 E34 clutch) (another 4hp stage)

4) CAI + pulleys + M50manifold + Chippeduk remap (25-30hp)

Don't bother going to the big breakers such as FAB direct. I have my number lodged with them and all the other large breakers. You will do much better going to the small local breakers.

The kit is perfect on an auto. It makes the gearchange much smoother.

With my kit, you will get about 221bhp from a 2.8, and 193bhp from a 2.5.

AHEALY wrote: Did anyone have any luck in sourcing M50 manifolds from someone in the Republic. If so, how much ?. Might be willing to travel but not as far as the North and the postage would probably be high and something that heavy.

As I said, I have good hope of getting few for less than 75€ in france. I could probably get them shipped straight to Alpina527 for less than 10€/manifold.

I let you know ASAP, but I am very hopefull to get 4 or 5 at this price.

Thanks Ludo, i'm based in Tullamore & you are in Athlone, so there should be no problem completing the transaction. Good luck with the Manifolds. 

Assuming we get the manifolds, and Alpina does the work on them, and forwards the full package including the larger throttle body, who could we get to finish the job for us.

I planned on doing it mysel!

I think with alpina kit it's a pretty straight forward thing to do. I'll try anyway, and then if I **** it up, I'll get somebody to sort it out!  seriously, I'll do it with a friend who is a good DIY mech, if you want to join us, you'll be welcome. Apparently it can be done in 3 or 4 hours.

Its not a difficult job to do, especially if its an Alpina prepped manifold! I did mine from scratch, so involves making new idle and breather pipework, brackets, modified fuel rail etc etc. Ian's manifold has all the breather/idle stuff grafted to the bottom of the manifold (as original M52), mine is seperate. I think even with Ian's kit, the fuel rail still has to be modified. The fixing brackets don't quite line up, so they need triming. I trimmed mine and then made small plates to reach the fixing points. I think Ian's includes these small adaptor brackets, but the fuel rail still needs a bit of trim. Best to get  Dremel!! I have a Dremel now but at the time I didn't, so used an angle grinder and hacksaw, being careful not to let the fuel rail get hot, otherwise I'd be fixing more than the inlet!!

It took me a day and a bit, but obviously this is because I had to fabricate brackets and pipes.

Do the 5 runs have to be the same day or can you spread it out?

That's how it works I think.

You'll get a big bre TB and then send yours back to alpina for uis next client!

I don't think I would ask alpina for a better price on his kit. Eurosport have the equivalent listed at €1000! We could save a bit on combining shipping.

For chippeduk, I think there is enough interest for him to come over rather than each of us going to england. For the date I would say it all depend when we can get the manifold sorted (the re-map is done after the manifold switch)

KenA,

Did you buy the software that was on ebay from chippeduk?

It sure would be an easier method to have someone in the north and south of ireland, i can always get a map back within 1 hour max and usually in less than 15 minutes so it is an excelent viable option.

Just too add, i have now added the following cars to the list that can be mapped using this programmer making the unit far more flexible.

E36:

2300cc siemans

2800cc siemans

3000cc M3

3200cc M3

E46:

2000cc siemans

2300cc siemans

2500cc siemans

2800cc siemans

3000cc siemans

3200cc M3

I have also added Smart petrol cars and audi and VW.

If anyone is 100% intrested in this venture then can they email me as i am sending out the units now.

I have added more cars to the list so this is a superb chance.

i will also do chips (for earlier cars) at lower prices so you have a full share of the market.

Anyone got lucky for the manifold?

So far I only managed to get few at 100€ which is a bit more that what we should pay for it. I still have one or two guys to callme back with new price offers.

ludo

Ok,

Just got an offer for 3 manifold @ €350 posted to alpina. I am waiting for one more call tomorrow morning and if nothing better comes along I think I'll go with those.

Takers PM!

Just got a couple of new phone No to ring as well.

It's not commercial, I am not making any money, I just try to source few manifold for the irish crowd as Alpina doesn't have any and it seems that the supply is running dry in ireland too!

It was just to let people interested in doing the mod and then get chippeduk over here for the mapping/chipping know that I managed to get my hand on few of them. Once again, zero profit for me in it (actually cost me money in phone call, all donation to my paypal account accepted! ), I'll produce receipt to anyone doubting about it .

Can you just let the post-up for a couple of days before you go and do your moderator job!

Ok,

I got 4 manifolds, 3 are sold/reserved so I have one left if anyone interested (120€) The last one is @ a different shop so if there is no taker I wont be getting it.

So far in are:

Ahealy, mikerd4, myself.