Need a bit of advice for drifting?

Bit wary of letting my hands go of the steering wheel when tail-sliding round a corner, what happens if i do?  Does the car try to follow the corner due to inertia or does it straighten up and head for the kerb?

stephenperry wrote: Need a bit of advice for drifting? Bit wary of letting my hands go of the steering wheel when tail-sliding round a corner, what happens if i do?  Does the car try to follow the corner due to inertia or does it straighten up and head for the kerb?

wooo first off practice in a big wide open space.  the aecc is the best place.  once you learn how she handles then consider doing it on the queens roads.

the hardest part is avoiding a tank slapper! embarrasing and not fun.  best advise i can give is go to the aecc car park and give her hell there.

you must be very very quick on the wheel.  it will not look pretty inside with your arms all over the place but that is what is required.

it will look better on the outside tho'  good vid or pic opportunity.  we can do this once the snow is here big style to save the tryres etc.

did you see the maxbimmer snow vid?

If you can avoid tail slide then i suggest you do it

pete323 wrote: If you can avoid tail slide then i suggest you do it

who's car is that pete?  or was it just a google search?

just asking cos ive recovered from a fair few slides at low speed in various rwd cars, some deliberate, some unintentional, some fishtailers/tank slappers, some not bad efforts, although im not that confident to really push it while going fast

my question was prompted by magazines, videos ive read and watched where people get the a*** out, then let go of the steering wheel and grip again to hold the angle (evo magazine "car of the year 2001" cover cd), but then again others, like the best motoring "drift bible" dvd, the guy never lets go of the wheel

silverbeastie wrote: pete323 wrote: If you can avoid tail slide then i suggest you do it who's car is that pete?  or was it just a google search?

Its Ben from Chromeline Design (e36coupe.com)

If you want to practice slides etc

Take some lessons with Accidont or others

Why risk crashing your own car when you could crash someone elses LOL

barf wrote: jeff heywood is organising skid pan training for club members at the staffordshire police facility. i went with paul kelly and a few other members last saturday, and i have to say it was quite a laugh sliding the old sierra (with slick rear tyres) on a wet, oily surface. in my opinion, £30 very well spent. i might book the wife on the women only session in february (cheaper than a big diamond, and the change will fund a trip to the ring...the one in germany!!!

i wonder if thats the same facility as was featured in the roadcraft police training dvd, they used an old sierra 2.0 gls

silverbeastie wrote: stephenperry wrote: Need a bit of advice for drifting? Bit wary of letting my hands go of the steering wheel when tail-sliding round a corner, what happens if i do?  Does the car try to follow the corner due to inertia or does it straighten up and head for the kerb? wooo first off practice in a big wide open space.  the aecc is the best place.  once you learn how she handles then consider doing it on the queens roads. the hardest part is avoiding a tank slapper! embarrasing and not fun.  best advise i can give is go to the aecc car park and give her hell there. you must be very very quick on the wheel.  it will not look pretty inside with your arms all over the place but that is what is required. it will look better on the outside tho'  good vid or pic opportunity.  we can do this once the snow is here big style to save the tryres etc. did you see the maxbimmer snow vid?

i havent yet, but ive just been sent it, cheers for the info 

anyone fancying a "fun in the snow" meet while the weather is bad?

pete323 wrote: If you want to practice slides etc Take some lessons with Accidont or others Why risk crashing your own car when you could crash someone elses LOL

so i take it you wont let me drive your car Pete?  

stephenperry wrote: silverbeastie wrote: stephenperry wrote: Need a bit of advice for drifting? Bit wary of letting my hands go of the steering wheel when tail-sliding round a corner, what happens if i do?  Does the car try to follow the corner due to inertia or does it straighten up and head for the kerb? wooo first off practice in a big wide open space.  the aecc is the best place.  once you learn how she handles then consider doing it on the queens roads. the hardest part is avoiding a tank slapper! embarrasing and not fun.  best advise i can give is go to the aecc car park and give her hell there. you must be very very quick on the wheel.  it will not look pretty inside with your arms all over the place but that is what is required. it will look better on the outside tho'  good vid or pic opportunity.  we can do this once the snow is here big style to save the tryres etc. did you see the maxbimmer snow vid? i havent yet, but ive just been sent it, cheers for the info  anyone fancying a "fun in the snow" meet while the weather is bad?

I'd be up for that but it must be somewhere wide open like the aecc car park.  don't fancy hitting a spectator or their car.

barf wrote: will fund a trip to the ring...the one in germany!!!

I like your sense of humour.  LOL

well the frost we had yesterday @ -2.5c has all gone, its just back to rainy and cold

looks like i'll have to wait a bit longer for some drifting practice

I bought a E30 323i a number of years ago and the guy took me for a test drive with a dirrerence.

Around Motherwell there was a one way system with plenty of roundabouts.  We broadsided from one to another right round town.  Superb I thought but should this guy not be takin it easy and kiddin on to me he is a Sunday driver?

After that fun I was hooked and with a dog leg box and a private plate thrown in too. Brilliant

Gentlemen

Please dont use the forum to organise events of this kind unless they are off the queens highway.

private land of course, Nigel!

if you did that sort of tail-out driving on the roads youd be rightly branded a maniac 

Never let go of the wheel.....

When powersliding, the throttle controls the car as much as the wheel anyway...........

Also, a good old fashioned LSD makes it much more fun........

alanross wrote: I bought a E30 323i a number of years ago and the guy took me for a test drive with a dirrerence. Around Motherwell there was a one way system with plenty of roundabouts.  We broadsided from one to another right round town.  Superb I thought but should this guy not be takin it easy and kiddin on to me he is a Sunday driver? After that fun I was hooked and with a dog leg box and a private plate thrown in too. Brilliant

reminds me of tagging along for a test drive of a 3-door sierra cosworth many years ago... the seller was a complete idiot "ex touring car driver dontcha know" aye, right, i believe ya son 

I'd recommend skid pans for this sort of stuff. I certainaly aim to do more than a couple in '05. 

As much as I find drifting amusing it seems to go against the grain of track craft of finding the absolute most traction to the point of balancing the rear at the pt of not stepping out and only then push the rear out to correct if you're pushing wide if say you've entered a turn to quickly. The worrying trend is now would be drifters trying to side as much as poss on track days..

KH has a skid pan and so does Crail which Willie also runs a figure of 8 track for drifting but even there many come unstuck. A little oversteer on the exit of a slow bend etc is one thing but trying to hang the tail out is best avoided on all roads.

Of course I'm still a little sensitive on the subject.

"ex touring car driver dontcha know" aye, right, i believe ya son

There is an ex touring car driver on this forum though.......

Brilliant thread .... I take it you will soon be in the market for a new set of rear slicks then Mr Perry?

I personally cant wait for that "Ultimate Driver Training" DVD to arrive ... but fear I will be extremely tempted to try out some of the tips on the M6/M65 interchange roundabout as it is over 3/4 a mile long, is really really wide and features some amazing cambers, and as the M65 is one of the quietest Mways in the country, is very very roomy. 

But for Nigels peace of mind, I shall refrain from doing so

Sometimes features some of these anyway, which results in an abrupt end to fun and frollicks.

I'm doing a skip pan day on 11th Dec at Bruntingthorpe with the VX220 club. Should get some good footage!!

My brother is too in his Z3. I suggested he uses 2 space saver wheels on the back - should make it a tad tail happy!!!

I wouldn't try it on a road as you don't always know the outcome esp. if your not used to it. Did it unintentionally when I first got my car, only a minor one, but unexpected never the less!!!

Rhys wrote: Praktisk wrote: Brilliant thread .... I take it you will soon be in the market for a new set of rear slicks then Mr Perry? ..the wonders of traction control ey, specially when you turn it off.

traction is there to B broken!

Here's a nice wee video of some nutters in Supras and Skylines drifting round a big (private ) roundabout

http://stephenperry.mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/Drift_Club.wmv - http://stephenperry.mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/Drift_Club. wmv

(10mb, right-click, save as...)

Got about 6mb and it suddenly completed... no video..just audio.. and you have the cheek to call my FTP server **** young man ... I dunno

Now I just get 404 error ... get it sorted lad!

Edited to remove objectionable language, please read the forum guidelines......oooh it so good to be back !!

no, thats the lousy tune that was on there already, id change it but you wouldnt hear the engines then

what song would you have preffered?

I thought about "Slide Away" by Oasis... rather apt dontchathink?

hehehe, sorted, it hadnt finished uploading before i posted the link

youre too impatient ;)

stephenperry wrote: youre too impatient ;)

Right back at ya !!!

Goldryder wrote: Traction control, imho, is the worst 'toy' you can find on a car.  Drifting and how to drift safely and in full control should be part of the driving lesson/test curriculum cos you never know when you might be caught out by weather or road conditions and find yourself in a drift situation.  Traction control gives a false sense of security and in some respects makes you lazy and you become complacent and lose the 'feel' of your vehicle.  My Supra's had it and it stayed switched off..infact I pulled the fuse on the system all together.  Was outlawed in certain motor racing, should be outlawed on road cars too, RWD cars are not that hard to control, whether you drift on purpose or by accident.  All you need is a sensitive behind and the knowledge of how to deal with it safely.

Unlike Goldie, for those poor souls who dont have Stig-like driving prowess traction control is a useful safety aid.  The BMW system is very forgiving and will only act in real emergencies, it will allow the rear end some play and you can get moderate amounts of tail-out action with the car correcting itself.  My car has http://www.bmw-lahta.ru/English/Technologies/Chassis/ASC_T.html - ASC+T  (DSC was an option), later E46's have http://www.bmw-lahta.ru/English/Technologies/Chassis/DSC.html - DSC as standard, and they all have http://www.bmw-lahta.ru/English/Technologies/Chassis/CBC.html - CBC  along with http://www.bmw-lahta.ru/English/Technologies/Chassis/ABS.html - ABS .

All these whizz bang electronics can sometimes adapt more quickly to a changing road surface than a normal person could, just look at http://stephenperry.mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/Nissan_Skyline_GTR_tailslide.avi - a Nissan Skyline and how it seemingly laughs at the laws of physics  (10mb... right-click, save as)

Nice vid...doesnt playin media player tho ...well not mine anyway, had to use BSPlayer .. skyline was good. Not so sure about the Supra.

Looked a bit like a mobile cinema having a mid life , sideways crisis on a roundabout. All them TV's !!!!

How do you twitch the back end out personally, I press the DSC off buton and do the on off throttle burst thing till it slips (on a big empty car park obviously)

traction control off, a nice greasy exit of a private roundabout and a moderate prod of the throttle in 2nd

or exiting a junction, from a standstill, in 1st, hoof it, get the back end to swing past when onto the main road and try not to fishtail!

on snow, i usually use a little dab of the handbrake to start off if i want to do a doughnut, havent got the hang of the scandinavian flick yet after nearly crashing into Currys shop window

Can see this thread getting made  by Nigel if this goes much further.

I was stood in the transport managers office at work only yesterday when there was a rather loud knock on the door, then enters a bloke (manger of National Tyres from the bottom of the street)

"one of your vans has come into the fitting bay hell for leather like it was being driven by Sterling ******* Moss this morning, he didnt notice that the roller shutter doors were only half up and hes took them clean out with his bleeding ladder-rack!!"

Now that did make me ... maybe the driver was practising a similar maneavour when coming out of the bottom of the street and the Tranee fish tailed right into Nationals shop front???

Ive seen the van, not really a scratch on it .. I also took a quick peek at Nationals doors ... favoured it had been hit by an RPG

Edited to remove objectionable language, please read the forum guidelines 

Praktisk wrote: Got about 6mb and it suddenly completed... no video..just audio.. and you have the cheek to call my FTP server **** young man ... I dunno Now I just get 404 error ... get it sorted lad! Edited to remove objectionable language, please read the forum guidelines......oooh it so good to be back !!

Now your just being picky Nigel ... yeah but no but yeah but no but ....

Ghia X wrote: yeah ive seen stephen drift whilst he had the acs on and it looked well smart and controlled

thanks, but the car pretty much sorts itself out with the tc on, you just need to steady the throttle and not be too snappy with the opposite lock

Drifting is the means to prolong oversteer or slide as long as possible. It's entertaining 4 sure on track but good driving teaches (road or track) to deal with oversteer as quickly as possible.

Learning to control oversteer is one thing but deliberately drifting on roads is nuts.. even experts get it wrong and can spin. Controlling oversteer is one thing and yes it can aid driving but provoking a drift to call it a means to learn how to drive better is an opinion I'd expect on http://www.nedsamongstus.com.org/nuts - www.nedsamongstus.com.org/nuts .

That aside I think any bimmer owner should learn to control oversteer ASAP. Let's discuss options at the AGM.

i'd really love to do one of those http://www.high-performance-course.co.uk - High Performance driving courses

To be honest thats what I thought I was going to learn when I did my http://www.iam.org.uk/ - IAM course, a little disappointed that the object wasn't to drive fast and safe 

hmm they sound good, bloke sounds like a bit of a pro too.

Get a date booked in the Better Driving Days Calendar and see who turns up, Ill def be up for a bit of that.

What and risk seeing my pride and joy drifting sideways down Cockburn Street .. noooo thank u very much.

I'll see if I can get a pass for that night and let you know. 

stephenperry wrote: good idea

Wasn't covered but perhaps an idea for shorty to consider in his new capacity.

a skid pan session is a good idea, i think they use mk3 granada 2.9s at knocky

id definately be up for that

oh and can we revive the karting session ideas again

kartstart in aberdeen is a good venue, good value for money too

shorty wrote: might see about block booking for skid pan at knockhill ??? but ounce again it will be a numbers & cost  issue .As was said last night we did have a situation where folks put forward that they would like a private day at a proper race track , it was all set up by Dunc & it was a case of " oh ! i will let you know nearer the time " which as you know is no good as all money must be paid upfront. which is a pity for bloke's like yourself Jon who support this type of event .

Aye it was bad what happened last time and I felt bad for Dunc and words were xchanged as the stress levels rose last time.. but we're not the only club this happens to..

Lets get the money up front then Shorty.. long running mbrs especially should get their monkey chequebooks out to encourage new members to join in.. if you need any help organising this sort of stuff u know where I am.  PM me as there are a coupele of other events being run by other regions that we may want to get in on. You can have my deposit now!

If we can get a core to pay a little more then maybe we'll have a better chance. Have you got Willie's contact details> I thkink Dunc has his number..

BR, Elton.

Crail also a skid pan so we can take our own cars and get a fee for oversteer fopr those who don't have access to private test tracks..

Crail can also do a figure of 8 oval to try drifting..

If we do another track day there - a whole day would easily allow us to try a the skid pan, drag, track and oval...all we have to do is organise with Willie to split into sessions.. that is if prices haven't gone up or Wullie hasn't been run out of twon bu the Crail folks..

We can then make sure plenty of digi-cams and feed into the video project..

Torch Str8 6 wrote: aye i wish the carts were V6, imagine that crabbing round the track LOL

I have a video of a kart with a cool engine in it.  i could upload it to stephens ftp server once it's working.  I have about 200 car vids, just stuff I've downloaded over a period of time.  How much space do you have available Stephen?

M BLUR wrote:   Crail also a skid pan so we can take our own cars and get a fee for oversteer fopr those who don't have access to private test tracks.. Crail can also do a figure of 8 oval to try drifting.. If we do another track day there - a whole day would easily allow us to try a the skid pan, drag, track and oval...all we have to do is organise with Willie to split into sessions.. that is if prices haven't gone up or Wullie hasn't been run out of twon bu the Crail folks.. We can then make sure plenty of digi-cams and feed into the video project..

 I think this sounds like a really good idea.  Much safer than trying it on the roads eh Stephen!

Filming the fun as well, for keeps and to show our mates.  Proving that rear wheel drive is the only 2 go.

See also Video Project thread.

[QUOTE=Webdunk]Money where your mouths are then chaps. £40 to James ASAP and we can set Shorty to looking at a date earlier than the July one pencilled in at http://www.bmwccscotland.co.uk/bmwcc/e2005.html/QUOTE - http://www.bmwccscotland.co.uk/bmwcc/e2005.html[/QUOTE ]

my only dilema is when I burn my tyres, they will no longer be road legal - for the journey home.  So I need a spare couple of rims to swap to just for the sesh'  I take it everybpdy else will be in the same situation?

Webdunk wrote: When Hamish went on his mad drifting mission in the 535i, he brought spare tyres with him. If you're just tracking your car rather than drifting then most tyres which had good life in them before you started will be perfectly legal to drive home on. Think the 330d boys got 3+ track days of fairly sporting driving out of OEM fit tyres.

Ideally I would like to leave my old tyres on the figure of 8 in liquid form! 

remember I'm from Aberdeen and want to get my moneys worth.

M BLUR wrote:   Crail also a skid pan so we can take our own cars and get a fee for oversteer fopr those who don't have access to private test tracks.. Crail can also do a figure of 8 oval to try drifting.. If we do another track day there - a whole day would easily allow us to try a the skid pan, drag, track and oval...all we have to do is organise with Willie to split into sessions.. that is if prices haven't gone up or Wullie hasn't been run out of twon bu the Crail folks.. We can then make sure plenty of digi-cams and feed into the video project..

With the surface at Crail I'll take my Touareg along

Paul

Webdunk wrote: Think the 330d boys got 3+ track days of fairly sporting driving out of OEM fit tyres.

erm, kind of.  That was actually 3 different sets of tyres

Where it goes pete tong for the tyres is if you get bored with driving fast round the track and try and improve your drifting skills

Deal!

I'll have a spare set by then so I'm good.. Jim.. I'll get £40 to you over next few days... PM and I'll send you a cheque.

Is there still a PayPal facility?

First event for the Video Project..

Guys,

Thanks for getting the motivation going but now that we've got a plan let's stick to it. I'm more than happy to take people's money for an earlier track day if there is interest, however, before I do I would like at least 15 names on the forum that are willing to commit to a particular day (at Tommy's discretion) and pay up front. Start a sticky and get the names on it, meanwhile I'll contact Willie and get this years dates and the latest prices and pass this onto Tommy so that he can make a call about when would be best to hold the event.

Thanks,

You have my name. Let me know when you want me to pay up.

Tommy.. happy to help.. let me know. Plz start a thread and let's get some names down.. if we go for a combined skid/track/thrash event then we shoudl cater for a range of tastes. Canvass Willie and see what costs are tho he tends to be reasonable.. not sure if it's just a drag strip at Edzell. If it also had a tarck then that would suit our Northern brethern too.