|
|
Post Reply 
|
Page 123> |
| Author | |
325captain 
Newbie 
Joined: 21-March-2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 25 |
 Topic: E30 M3’SPosted: 02-March-2005 at 08:57 |
|
Gents, can you tell me if theres any difference in performance between the early 195bhp cars and the later 215bhp cars. The performance figures seem to suggest theres not, any of you guys have first hand experience. i am looking at buying an m3 shortly but have only driven the earlier cars, any info appreciated.
|
|
 |
|
| Sponsored Links | |
|
|
|
Eamo
Moderator Group 
Joined: 13-May-2003 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 3450 |
Posted: 02-March-2005 at 09:01 |
|
theres not taht much between the 2 although the 215bhp model will have a cat and the other doesnt
|
|
|
|
|
lancelotII
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 24-November-2002 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 853 |
Posted: 02-March-2005 at 09:07 |
|
Very little, certainly not enough to warrant lots more cash (other than for the reason of it being a younger car). Fundamentally, the biggest benefit of the later cars is their tunability, they had the bigger throttle bodies. The power figures also need to be taken with a pinch of salt, most 215er's only make just over 200, most 190/195er's make just about that or a little less. If you want to release power, a remap and cams normally see them well over the factory numbers. i.e mine makes 220 (with cams and remap), and it's specced as a 190 Cat model.
HTH |
|
|
|
|
Mike 90 M3
Really Senior Member I 
Joined: 08-July-2004 Status: Offline Points: 320 |
Posted: 02-March-2005 at 09:54 |
|
So the 215bhp cars have the 48mm throttle bodies then? Didn't know that! |
|
|
|
|
UweM3
Moderator Group
Joined: 11-February-2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 5445 |
Posted: 02-March-2005 at 10:05 |
|
Go for a 215bhp model. Power isn't much different in standard spec, but as soon you start "optimising" it the 215bhp is the better basis. Not only 48mm throttles, the inlet ports in the cylinder head are bigger (26 versus 28mm). Also bigger Airfilter housing.
BTW 195bhp are always with CAT, the 200bhp model is the one without cat. If you are intend NOT to modify it, look for condition of the car rather than spec. A good shell is always worth having. Everything else can be retro fitted. Edited by UweM3 |
|
|
E61 520d, slow and buzzy but my wallet likes the mpg.....
|
|
|
|
|
lancelotII
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 24-November-2002 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 853 |
Posted: 02-March-2005 at 10:16 |
|
Uwe, is that right that the 215's had bigger air filter housing ? I know the US cars had the piddly little snorkel and stuff but I didn't realise that the 195 Euro cars airbox was smaller than the late 215's.
Roops |
|
|
|
|
325captain
Newbie
Joined: 21-March-2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 25 |
Posted: 02-March-2005 at 10:47 |
|
cheers fellas, i think i am leaning toward a later 215 car as i wouldnt mind a few track days (every little helps). I have had a look at a couple of cars but have been a little disappointed in what ive seen, so the hunt goes on?! what do you think i shoud be getting on a budget of 7.5k? |
|
|
|
|
lancelotII
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 24-November-2002 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 853 |
Posted: 02-March-2005 at 11:01 |
|
Dont' get too anal about mileage. These cars are much better being driven than resting in a garage and driven occassionally. A good wadge of receipts and history is essential. As you have probably read the timing chain issue is overblown so don't get hung up about that either. A well cared for high mileage car, with a good straight body should be findable.
Good luck |
|
|
|
|
Darren M
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 31-October-2002 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 533 |
Posted: 02-March-2005 at 11:26 |
|
I was always surprised that the Evo II only had the 46mm bodies. Why is this, given that it has the best engine bar the Evo Sport? When does the TB become a bottleneck? I`ve heard of 250bhp (just a number I know) evo 2`s still with t he 46`s.
Always been curious about the 46vs 48mmm TB`s, wondering what kinda of BHP levels do the 46`s become a problem :) |
|
|
|
|
Nostrils
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 27-October-2002 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 792 |
Posted: 02-March-2005 at 12:00 |
|
325captain. I think you will be OK with that money. I would look at the bodywork especially for the usual rust spots near the windscreen door areas. There are a few out there, so take your time and get the car you want.....I was a little hasty with mine, but despite that I am over the moon with it and its coming up to its 6th birthday in my hands!
|
|
|
Phil
|
|
|
|
|
Chris Miller
Really Senior Member I
Joined: 20-September-2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 445 |
Posted: 02-March-2005 at 12:44 |
|
Also check the front of the sills just behind front wheel arch.
There looks like a metal box shape which people think is a jacking point. They use these to jack the car up which can cause damage and eventually results in rust.
Had to have this repaired on one side of my car.
|
|
|
|
|
UweM3
Moderator Group
Joined: 11-February-2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 5445 |
Posted: 02-March-2005 at 12:51 |
|
Darren, the EVO2 head has got the big inlet port and the 46mm throttles are bigger at the "head side" as the standard 46mm throttles. So in reality we have 3 sets of throttles.
46mm with small inlet head ports 46mm with big inlet head ports 48mm with same inlet port size than EVO2 The 215bhp engine is basically a EVO2 engine with lower compression pistons and 48mm throttles. Roops, as far as I know the 195hbp cars do have the same airfilter housing as the US cars (or the other way round whatever you prefer). It's just the lower section of the housing and the inlet trumpet going to the bumper. I am hunting for one (Kevin  ) as I am told that the lower section on it's own is NLA, you need to buy the whole box to get hold of one. Haven't checked that at the dealer myself, might be one off these myth's.
|
|
|
E61 520d, slow and buzzy but my wallet likes the mpg.....
|
|
|
|
|
Rob L
Really Senior Member I
Joined: 22-October-2002 Location: South East Status: Offline Points: 384 |
Posted: 02-March-2005 at 13:19 |
|
Another good thread - never realised there were so many diferences in
the ports. :) |
|
|
|
|
Nostrils
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 27-October-2002 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 792 |
Posted: 02-March-2005 at 13:23 |
|
Phil
|
|
|
|
|
Simon325i sport
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 13-November-2003 Location: South Wales Status: Offline Points: 1022 |
Posted: 02-March-2005 at 15:22 |
|
I'm also looking for a new lower airbox section, as mine is broken, and I need the later type. Weird really as I was only checking on the ETK on the weekend, and it will not show the part number for the lower section on it's own, so Uwe, it looks like what you've heard is right! Edited by Simon325i sport |
|
|
|
|
|
|
M3Nally
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 28-May-2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1302 |
Posted: 02-March-2005 at 16:15 |
|
So why did they not build the Evo Sport with high compression pistons like evo2 to get nearer 250bhp. After all 18bhp with 48mm TB's is not alot more than my evo2 at 220bhp with only 2.3l engine.
Was there a power restriction for racing as well as engine size in DTM at the time? |
|
|
|
|
lancelotII
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 24-November-2002 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 853 |
Posted: 03-March-2005 at 04:02 |
|
..because higher compression engines need higher octane fuel, with the advent of unleaded, there was no equivalent of 5 star around at the time. Therefore, BMW probably thought it would be a load less hassle (owners returning pinking cars..) just to build the evo sport with the l/c pistons. Also, remember the Evo concept of these cars was all about getting items homologated for racing. They already had the h/c pistons available from the evo2 so probably didn't need to build the evo sport with them, to allow them to be used for racing.
As for the power restrictions, none. The only limits were written into the Group A regs that allowed homologated items. (Anyone remember Audi getting stripped of their championship because they had used un-homolgated engines parts in their V8) Roops |
|
|
|
|
UweM3
Moderator Group
Joined: 11-February-2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 5445 |
Posted: 03-March-2005 at 04:15 |
If it makes 238bhp....... Have said that many times, the EVO2 is probably the best M3 in STOCK condition. They all make 220bhp or very close! |
|
|
E61 520d, slow and buzzy but my wallet likes the mpg.....
|
|
|
|
|
lancelotII
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 24-November-2002 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 853 |
Posted: 03-March-2005 at 04:29 |
Ahhhh, then I already have the big collector box. The only issue with mine is that the previous owner thought it would flow loads more air by by drilling holes in the back of it........obviously, simple physics wasn't his strong point.... |
|
|
|
|
M3Nally
Really Senior Member II
Joined: 28-May-2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1302 |
Posted: 03-March-2005 at 04:35 |
|
Roops,
Thanks for that info, it figures. I will have to get mine up on some rollers to find out then. First I want to get the valve clearances checked and have the TB's balanced. Anyone on here in the Essex/ Suffolk/ Norfolk area got the kit to do my valves? My usual mechanic hasn't got the shim kit and otherwise it would have to be a dealer. Cheers Kevin |
|
|
|
|
Post Reply
|
Page 123> |
|
| Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |
E30 M3’S
Topic Options
lancelotII wrote:
