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petesm3 View Drop Down
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Joined: 31-October-2002
Location: United Kingdom
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Points: 89 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 09:36
You can only compare cars from the same era, 2/10 slower than a 4 wheel drive 16v turbo, not bad at all, car looked great, SportKa vs today's M3?
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Joined: 18-March-2005
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Points: 67 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 09:30
My car was 195 bhp when it left the factory. It's 203 now at just over 100k miles.

Ok so it no longer has a cat, but it goes to show age and mileage doesn't necessarily mean less power.

Still lovin' it, balls to the naysayers.
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AndyS View Drop Down
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Joined: 21-August-2003
Location: 55 � North
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Points: 1365 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 09:28
I can't believe all the clucking & wailing that's going on over this!

Yes, a lower mileage M3 would have been better but what state would the shopping trolleys be in with 170k on them? Exactly.

A 15% drop in power is pretty good for that mileage. Did you think there would be no drop off? Can a 45 year old still run as fast as a 20 year old?

Cars are designed to run on normal roads not racing tracks. That's why they break if you thrash them on a track.  A track time is as relevant to normal use as a 0-60 time.  Will those shopping trolleys be breathing down the neck of an XJR on the open road? Of course not.

As for the tosspot comments about Needells driving - give over. It's not as if you could get anywhere near his level except in your dreams.

With the reality check over it comes down to the fact that none of the "hot" hatches on the list will ever be as cool as an M3, now or in 20 years time, no matter how fast they can go. End of story.

Tell that to the p1ss-takers.

Car looked good by the way Aaron. A credit to you.
AndyS
Live each day as if it's your last - one day it will be.
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trackM3 View Drop Down
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Joined: 13-April-2005
Location: Brands Hatch
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Points: 549 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 09:17
Originally posted by kevin kevin wrote:

Originally posted by E30 M3 Evo 1 E30 M3 Evo 1 wrote:

Originally posted by trackM3 trackM3 wrote:

Just go out and have fun with the car's we all Love, it doesn't matter !

Here Here!!  Lets all go out to play!



Well said...book up for Croft or take it to the Nordschleife or any other track and just enjoy what you have in it's natural habitat
Thats what i want, positivity ?= enjoyment 

HAPPY CRIMBO.
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Joined: 29-November-2002
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Points: 3189 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 09:13
Originally posted by E30 M3 Evo 1 E30 M3 Evo 1 wrote:

Originally posted by trackM3 trackM3 wrote:

Just go out and have fun with the car's we all Love, it doesn't matter !

Here Here!!  Lets all go out to play!



Well said...book up for Croft or take it to the Nordschleife or any other track and just enjoy what you have in it's natural habitat
Kevin
'04 E46 330Ci Convertible
'08 E61 535d Touring (TorqueMeister Towbarge)
’95 E34 M5
’89 E30 M3 (Cecotto)
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Joined: 01-August-2005
Location: Coventry, UK
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Points: 343 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 08:47

This is the busiest I've ever seen this forum...

... hope it continues!

Avus E36 M3.0
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BMW M = Big Money Worries Multiplied

Joined: 20-April-2005
Location: Billericay, Essex
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Points: 118 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 08:42
Originally posted by trackM3 trackM3 wrote:

Just go out and have fun with the car's we all Love, it doesn't matter !

Here Here!!  Lets all go out to play!
Alpine White E30 M3 Evo 1
Imola Red E46 318TiSE Compact - Gone
Royal Blue E34 535i Sport - Gone but not Forgotten
Sparkling Graphite E90 320d SE.
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Joined: 20-April-2005
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Points: 118 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 08:40

Originally posted by Chris Miller Chris Miller wrote:

IThe e46 would easily out handle a standard E30 M3 as well.

I'm sure it would, but how many people will lust after them and talk about their racing heritage and pedigree 15-20 years from now?

I'm almost certain the Street Ka won't be held in such high regard in the year 2021 (BTW I should point out that I'm part of the Electrical design team on these things..... Ask Rezaq)

Like Rezaq I suffered hideous amounts of abuse due to being beaten by the Lancia, but working here in Ford my misery was confounded with the beloved M3 only marginally faster than the Street Ka

I'm sure my car's ears are burning so I'll go and keep her company in the garage this evening

Not forgetting: Aaron, your car looked awesome in the hands of Tiff. Even if he was sliding around a bit, it was still much tidier than the Lancia.   I've got mine back now so perhaps see in you Billericay sometime?
Alpine White E30 M3 Evo 1
Imola Red E46 318TiSE Compact - Gone
Royal Blue E34 535i Sport - Gone but not Forgotten
Sparkling Graphite E90 320d SE.
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Joined: 13-April-2005
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Points: 549 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 08:31

Just go out and have fun with the car's we all Love, it doesn't matter !

Regards
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Chris Miller View Drop Down
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Points: 445 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 08:13

I have a standard car with exception of lowering springs. Does have totally new suspension with all original BMW parts except the springs.

This thread does need to be taken in context everyone here has a soft spot for the E30 but put in context it is a 20 year old car in its basic design and there has been huge progress over the last 20 years.

In all of these comparions ( i kept up with a this and that) the driver is the most important factor. We can hardly say Tiff Needle cant drive very well so why dispute his laptime . Im sure he is by far quicker than anyone that posts here. People have mentioned about Aarons car having done 170k but if my memory serves me correctly hasnt it had  an engine rebuild in the not too distant past.

I had an E46 M3 for a while and it would totally aniliate an E30 M3 if driven by drivers of comparable standard.

The e46 would easily out handle a standard E30 M3 as well. The difference is that the E30 is much easier to control and is more balanced on the limit but you will still be traveling much slower.

Chris.
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Joined: 16-October-2005
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Points: 28 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 08:08
Ultegra, whats a gaper?
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Nick @ TBMW View Drop Down
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Points: 173 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 08:06
Originally posted by Dazzieboy Dazzieboy wrote:

I would be up for an E30 M3 day at Angelsey, need to make it late spring early summer to replicate the conditions maybe Nick@TBMW could cover it as a magazine feature Would be a good follow on story and hopefully put the newly started myth that shopping cars are faster to bed
If you guys want to arrange it, we'll be there, and probably doing lots of driving too since Angry is one of my fave circuits
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Points: 173 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 08:05
Originally posted by UweM3 UweM3 wrote:

And you forget one very important thing.
You are NOT ALLOWED to do ANY timing on a track day.
Instantly banned!
I don't support the idea of beating Tiffs time. The M3 has NOTHING to prove. Neither do we as the owners.

I am owning an M3 because I like it as is. End of story.
Doesn't bother me that it becomes a little old now. Things move on. Wait another 10 years....
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Points: 853 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 08:03
Reminder to self.....at my next track day I must keep an eye in the mirror for fast approaching hot hatches.....not...

Seriously, while my car is only midly modified, a few of us normally get lumped in with the race cars at track days, being experienced trackers. There have been plenty of ocassions when we are passing full race cars in our mildly tuned road cars. Sure we are not blasting past, but speed through and exiting corners appears to be much better than a lot of more modern machinery even in race guise.

Trust me, I don't think an e30 M3 is the fastest thing on the planet, but owners of them really shouldn't be concerned about Sport KA's and the like.
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Points: 69 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 08:02
I would be up for an E30 M3 day at Angelsey, need to make it late spring early summer to replicate the conditions maybe Nick@TBMW could cover it as a magazine feature Would be a good follow on story and hopefully put the newly started myth that shopping cars are faster to bed
The Future's The Past
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UweM3 View Drop Down
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Joined: 11-February-2003
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Points: 5445 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 08:02
And you forget one very important thing.
You are NOT ALLOWED to do ANY timing on a track day.
Instantly banned!
I don't support the idea of beating Tiffs time. The M3 has NOTHING to prove. Neither do we as the owners.

I am owning an M3 because I like it as is. End of story.
Doesn't bother me that it becomes a little old now. Things move on. Wait another 10 years....
E61 520d, slow and buzzy but my wallet likes the mpg.....
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Points: 123 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 07:48

That good eh?! 

Cool. 

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Nick @ TBMW View Drop Down
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Points: 173 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 07:47
Yup  
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AaronM3 View Drop Down
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Points: 123 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 07:44

Is TBMW- Total BMW, Nick... ?

'cuse ignorance!
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Nick @ TBMW View Drop Down
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Points: 173 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-December-2005 at 07:43
Originally posted by AaronM3 AaronM3 wrote:

It was running NCT-5's at the time and now Eagle F1's.  The brake discs and pads are stock as is the suspension.

Perhaps it would be a fine idea for a number of us to arrange an Anglesey track day in the new year- it would be interesting to see what kind of times the modified cars can post and provide a satisfactory conclusion to this matter.  And I would certainly be interested to see if I can beat Tiff's time- imagine the bragging rights!

Does anyone else have a bone-stock car we can use as a benchmark as it seems to be of the opinion of some that there is something lacking in my car's performance.

It would be fun, but you'd have take it as just that - fun!

There'd be so many levels of driver skill on the day (and some might say... balls) that nothing scientific could be gained from it.

It would be a good laugh though 
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