E34 wins coveted award!

Yes Derek, but some of us can't afford an M5, I'd love to own one, but a 540i would be a very good second best car

Paul

I can see this debate is going to run and run... Blimey, what have I started here

Yes, the 525i was recognised as the best all-rounder, and it is a cracking car, no question about that-I have a '95 525i 24v Vanos Touring and it's a great car that leaves you with a warm glow inside.

Much easier to find than either the 540i or M5, no Nikasil worries and easy to insure, cheap to fuel as well.

Probably the least troublesome of the E34 variants to own, apart from the 'hilarious' plastic impellered water pump debacle on the 24v engines that could overheat the engine and fry the expensive multivalve head if you didn't spot it failing in time.

Other than that the 525i's are generally bomb-proof with no Nikasil worries, and deeply satisfing to own.

In my experience, whilst more economical than the big-engined models, the difference isn't that great as the E34 is a heavy beast so round town even the smaller engined models drink a bit in stop-start traffic.

Not sure about 'less problems with heads' though, as I've not had head problems with either my 525i 24v or my 540i, and neither engine design was ever really troublesome in that department, unlike the older 12v sixes that could knock out camshafts and crack heads etc.

Al-I agree that the 540i doesn't have quite the same ring about it as the M5, but then the M5 owners bank balance will have an altogether hollower 'ring' to it than the 540i owners bank balance

Touche!!!

Alex

In the real world though, all our car choices are determined by budgetary constraints.

One particular car magazine would conduct group tests, and give a verdict based on the cars own absolute ability and not take the price into consideration.

Then they'd publish a verdict based on the vehicle's price, which gave an entirely different result, using the same cars in the group test.

I could drive countless different cars which are all better than the old E34 540i, but it'd be a pointless exercise if I couldn't then afford to buy one of these superior cars.

The point I was trying to make is that you don't have to pay much money for a good 540i, which means that even someone on a tight budget could consider one of these reliable old rocketships and not end up in the financial 'sherbert dip' unless they bought a ropey old failed Nikasil example.

Yes, it'll be high mileage with softish suspension, but you can't have everything unless you have an unrestricted budget.

There are countless better cars than an old E34 540i, but at what cost?

As a rough generalisation, people will try and get the best car they can on the budget they can comfortably afford.

The problem with aspirational dreams and hard reality is that there's ususally a yawning financial gap separating them, so you have to find the best compromise between vehicle ability and price/running costs.

Is a £60,000 M5 really 20 times better than a £3000 540i, to put it in it's rawest and most simplistic terms? Is it 20 times more powerful? Does it corner 20 times more sharply? How exactly do you quantify this anyway?

Of all the cars I've ever owned or driven-and there've been plenty, including many non-BMW's, the E34 540i stands out as unique for the money, and that's the reason I rate it so highly amongst E34's, because they're so cheap to buy if you can get a decent one without Nikasil woes, as that's their only real Achillies Heel.

I own an E34 525i as well, so can directly compare them in terms of running costs/fuel consumption etc. Believe it or not, the 540i doesn't use much more fuel than the 525i if you drive them in a similar manner.

That's the proviso, though, as the 540i encourages you to drive fast, so you think it's using vastly more fuel when in fact it's the different driving style that plays the bigger part.

Driven in exactly the same manner, my 540i will use about 20% more fuel than a similarly driven 525i. If I then cane the 540i, it'll drink up to 40% more fuel than a caned 525i, as I've measured the respective fuel consumptions back-to-back after applying the correct calibration factors to their trip computers and also using the brim method over known distances.

They both have the same wheel & tyre size, so no difference there. 8 litres of engine oil versus 5, 8 spark plugs versus 6, not a vast difference there either.

Apart from the V8 Nikasil woes neither respective engine is prone to major failure, and both share similar drivetrains and suspension layouts, excepting the different damper rates etc.

The V8 exhaust system will be notably more expensive though, but that's really only the main downside.

The E34 was the second of the 'modern' shape BM's, behind the E32, so still looks modern today, which is why it's stood the test of time so well.

It was also very well engineered, with no noticeable cost cutting anywhere-they're very solidly built cars, as their extra weight over the outgoing E28's will testify.

My original motivation for starting this thread was to acknowledge the fact that, of all the BM's you can buy used, it was the E34 that was rated by the general motoring trade because it offered so much for so little cash, and price was a major driving force behing my own decision to choose the E34.

Yes, I'd love a new £80,000 M6 in black, as it would be massively better then my old tubs, but I just ain't got that kind of money, so I bought the 'best available for the limited budget'

Which is why Car Mechanics awarder the E34 the honours

And also why it's my 'best car'-it provides huge fun for not much cash.

Alex

Derek M5 wrote: I think this should b renamed the 540 worship thread or somesuch I can see no reason to ever sell my E34 M5 - not even for one of your 540's!

I would love an M5 but need an estate and I've only ever seen 2, both very expensive and both LHD! apart from that, it'd be my next car, though I am looking to get an LSD from a 5 and improve my performance with a few tweaks to match or improve on the M5. I can't join 'em, I'll beat 'em!! lol

Mike

Feck me you 540 lot are a sensitive bunch!

The point I was trying perhaps none too subtley put across is that it's the E34 - in all of it's guises that won the award because they are utterly superb cars!

I'm not sure (E30 owners look away now) BMW have made anything as strong or enduring before or after it.

The sad fact of the matter is, your avarage spanner monkey won't be able to maintain an E34 M5 due to it's added complexities so in fact the award probably goes to the E34 not including the M5?

I'll get me coat!

Well, I personally wouldn't spend 10K on a 1.8 Focus 

Whilst the Focus may have been worth more after 3 years, it has further to fall than a £6k BMW 328i, which has pretty much bottomed out of the depreciation curve and lost most of it's value early on before you bought it-that's the great thing about savage depreciation.

I bought my '93 K 540iA with 88k on the clock almost exactly 3 years ago to the day for £4500, with 2 previous owners, full history, and a warranted new Alusil engine fitted at the main dealers at 45k.

I get rather more than 20mpg from the car-25mpg to be precise on my 40 mile round trip commute to work, and 30mpg on a long run. Neither of these figures are pie-in-the-sky overestimations either, but accurate measurements using the brim method and accurate mileage info from maps and motorway markers.

I have bog-standard 15 inch alloys, and new tyres cost £70 and last 2 years. The car just doesn't break down either, and servicing is peanuts-I change my own oil and filters/plugs etc.

I drive fast but economically, not applying power if I have to scrub it off again rapidly-a technique that minimises brake usage and means I haven't had to change the pads or discs since I bought the car 3 years and 36,000 miles ago.

It's been the cheapest fast car I've ever run and, with the warranted Alusil replacement engine and the current new MOT, it'd still fetch around £2k in a private sale, so depreciation has been minimal too.

None of this is speculation either-they've been my observations over 3 years of 540i ownership.

You can keep your 10K 1.8 Focus

Buying a 3k car that costs more to run per month, or buying a 6k car that costs less to run per month is six of one, half a dozen of the other if you added up the total respective motoring costs over identical periods of ownership.

The extra 3K that you borrow to buy the 6K car will cost you more per month in finance charges, nicely negating the lower monthly running costs of the 6k car.

I could have spent my £4500 on a 3-year old quality small car, but I deliberately chose not to as I would have been bored senseless with it.

I wanted some excitement for my cash so I gambled on the E34 540i, and it's been the best motoring decision I've ever made, period.

That's why, like many other have found out themselves on here, I'm fiercely loyal to it, as my ownership experience has been nothing but pleasure at low cost with big thrills and no scary bills

Finally, I should add that I'm a big fan of the 24v sixes in the E34 models-it really is a sweet little engine and very eager to rev, and my own 525i 24v Touring is a superb all-rounder, very solidly built as only E34's are, and, as someone else said on here, definately one of the 'over-engineered' BMW model ranges.

Whichever model you choose you can't go wrong!

The 525i 24v Vanos models are the best overall all-rounders, and the 540i with a healthy engine is one of the great performance bargains of the decade.

The small six is a very sweet engine in the large E34 bodyshell, and very refined and a joy to rev. It is more sensible and economical for most people, but by no means is it an economy car due to the heavy E34 bodyshell.

You'd need a 10k 1.8 Focus to get an economy car, except that spending 10k to save a few hundred pounds a year on fuel isn't what I'd call 'economy'

The whole E34 range is so cheap to buy now that you can your pick of which model is for you, as there isn't really a 'wrong un'. Even the 518i has it's virtues if you understand it's role properly.

it's just that some variants are more 'right' than others

Nothing like a good lively debate though...

Alex

I'd like to add that Ford Focuses (Focii?), in common with all recent Fords are a victim of oversupply because of their popularity with fleet buyers and in this case the buying public so secondhand prices are driven down hard, good news for the buyer, not so good for the seller

Buy a Focus if you want a good all-rounder, surprisingly willing and able, my mother likes hers (a 99T 1.8 LX with 60k bought from a Ford main dealer a few months ago for less than £3k) but don't buy one if you want to try and sell it at a profit or want to stand out - they're just too common on the roads (bit like the 3-series really )

i'm surprised about your comments regarding the torque steer (unless it was a Focus RS), never found any real evidence of it in the focii i've driven