E46 engine internal wear. Burns oil like crazy. |
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Individual_11
Newbie Joined: 21-April-2008 Location: Leeds West Yorks Status: Offline Points: 10 |
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Posted: 13-December-2008 at 23:48 |
Hi Barry
Not entirely sure off the top of my head so will have to go digging but I'm sure it was less that £200 - I seem to remember £110 and the part being about £40. Will have to see what I can find in my bills! The dealer I went to also discounts if your car is over 5 years old - but you have to ask! Russ |
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Barry_Mc
Senior Member I Joined: 27-March-2007 Status: Offline Points: 141 |
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thanks for that, Russ, i'd say your right, must be the scavenger valve he was talking about...i don't think you have to touch the heads to replace the valve seals. i tried to get a price for that job but i'd say if they can find a simpler solution with less effort they will, which makes sense i suppose. out of interest how much were you charged for the scavenger valve job, i was told 7hrs, (55e / hr) and i think the part is around 76e - 460e approx. (he didn't say 460, just 7hr job etc etc... MBW1 - breather pipes, must have a look into that, only starting to get an idea of the inner workings. |
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MBW1
Senior Member I Joined: 12-June-2008 Status: Offline Points: 132 |
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The problem is almost certainly the breather pipes to an from the valve.
They turn to chewing gum and block up inside and dramatically increase oil consumption. Replace these and it'll probably be okay. 2.2 M54's are well known for using oil anyway. |
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I don't have a carbon footprint. I drive everywhere.
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Individual_11
Newbie Joined: 21-April-2008 Location: Leeds West Yorks Status: Offline Points: 10 |
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Hi Barry
If he means the valve that lets pressure out of the crank case back into the manifold (so called scavenger valve) then I've had that done. BMW decided that that was the most likely cause of mine (apparently it gets clogged inside and the oil isn't trapped out but ends up on the inlet manifold being burned). It apparently is like a tiny cyclone valve (think dyson) that traps any oil in the gas flowing from the bottom to the top of the engine. I think you can see it under the inlet manifold! They had to take the inlet manifold off to get at it and for my car it didn't make any difference! I was wondering if the valve guide seals can be replaced without taking the head to bits and what it might cost.... Hmmm Russ |
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Barry_Mc
Senior Member I Joined: 27-March-2007 Status: Offline Points: 141 |
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latest...checked the oil level last night, on the min mark, so i topped up today, 1 ltr, (which is exactly min to max) perfect, i'll admit i didn't check the level after topping up) basically had a bit of a hickup at some stage, reckon i was in too high a gear, accelerated, car choked for sec and ran on as usual, only time it missed a beat all day or any day for that, checked the oil level tonight, back to min....(i didn't buy invisible oil...hehehe, has me worried at this stage. no oil leaks by the way. i rang an ex bmw mech to get a quote for valve seal replacement, he suggested relief valve (don't quote me there) that there is a good chance its clogged, different driving style to the previous owner would be the cause, mainly slower driving, i'd put it down to speed bumps if thats the case...(other than me...lmao), he has gone straight for that everytime and has sorted plenty of bm's with similar symtoms. anyway, i'm trying to figure out.... 1. what happened my oil? 2. how does the relief valve work? 3. as far as i know the valve is attached to the oil pump, where is that located? 4. and finally does the manifold have to come off to gain access? thanks in advance, barry found this.. http://www.autohausaz.com/bmw-auto-parts/bmw-oil-pressure.ht ml good info, doesn't answer my q's...might be of interest. Edited by Barry_Mc |
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Barry_Mc
Senior Member I Joined: 27-March-2007 Status: Offline Points: 141 |
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interesting links I-11, if i had the consumption levels of the lads in the first post xmas would have come early!!! the DIY guide in the second post is spot on, but i don't think i'll try it...lol, def one to be left to the experts i think...seems to be the fix, if the seal colours are correct then there is obv a flaw and it would be interesting to know which engine has the green or red seals? i might change my oil to be honest, reading the 2nd post 5w-30 isn't up to the running temp of the m54, which 0w-30 and 5w-40 are, so i think as i'm due a service i might chance 5w-40, not 100% but i think majority of members use 5w-40, worth a try at least...might be a cheap fix, if i get back to 1000-1200 / ltr i'll be happy enough although my gut is telling me the damage has been done... |
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autofix
Really Senior Member I Joined: 23-August-2003 Location: Kildare Status: Offline Points: 294 |
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But ring/bore problems give different symptoms to stem seals. As far as I am aware the lads in the workshop in Quarry are well clued in. Any good mechanic should be able to diagnose stem seals. |
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Kane Automotive
Mercedes, BMW and VAG Diagnostic Specialist |
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Individual_11
Newbie Joined: 21-April-2008 Location: Leeds West Yorks Status: Offline Points: 10 |
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Ta very much for the recommendation! |
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Peter Fenwick
Bavarian-Board Contributor Joined: 27-August-2003 Location: Lost somewhere in time... Status: Offline Points: 6484 |
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There's a half decent Indie near York, which isn't too far from leeds. http://www.atlasautoservices.co.uk/ I had an E39 530 with an M54 engine and that used a litre of oil every 1500-2000 miles.
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Entering an age of Austerity and now driving a Focus Diesel.
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Individual_11
Newbie Joined: 21-April-2008 Location: Leeds West Yorks Status: Offline Points: 10 |
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Last one for now..
It's not just the 3 series M54's that have the problem. Check out.. http://forum.bmw5.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=23760 Also they sign to a thread on here where someone ended up finding it was valve seals - which rings a bit true with some of my symptoms - but make your mind up... http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=404447&pag e=5
I-11 |
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Individual_11
Newbie Joined: 21-April-2008 Location: Leeds West Yorks Status: Offline Points: 10 |
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Thanks for that - it's a good point. So if it has a problem with oil rings, is it worth getting the engine in bits to try fix? Or is it worth just putting a "cheaper" synth or semi synth in and running? I'm going to change the oil as I'm not happy with the High Mileage stuff in there. A thought but if the thick oil is not good around the valves, could the valve stem seals be the mode of entry of the oil into the cylinder? Sorry if that's a stupid question and thanks to everyone contributing. Nice to know you're all out there! I-11
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Individual_11
Newbie Joined: 21-April-2008 Location: Leeds West Yorks Status: Offline Points: 10 |
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Spooky that. I've been using the same oil since new in the car, regular services and FBMWSH. Mine was the same about a ltr every 1200 miles. I queried it with the supplying dealer in 2002 and they checked the car over and then said it was fine and in normal tolerance (which BMW claim is 1 ltr in 750 miles). Then like you suddenly 1 ltr every 600ish miles down to 1 ltr every 400miles. BMW had the manifold off to do the breather valve and it was clean. They didn't test compression (as it was expensive job for them to do it and I don't know a good indie garage in Leeds and they reckoned with the car's history that shouldn't be the problem). Originally wondered if an oil control ring had shed or failed. I also wondered if the oil was getting too hot or if there is some way the engine could "suck up oil" when you lift the throttle - though as I said the manifold is clear (I'm told) and the breather valve replaced by BMW. I think it's defo the same thing though as the symptoms are spookily so the same and it seems peculiar to the M54 2.2's I-11
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autofix
Really Senior Member I Joined: 23-August-2003 Location: Kildare Status: Offline Points: 294 |
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I have seen a small number of m54’s burning oil due to bottom end wear. If as someone posted, using a heavier oil lowered the oil consumption then that would point to wear rather than a breathing problem. Another point worth noting is that compression and oil usage can have nothing in common. Oil and compression rings on the pistons do two different jobs. It is quite possible to have worn oil rings with good compression. |
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Kane Automotive
Mercedes, BMW and VAG Diagnostic Specialist |
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RMAR24
Newbie Joined: 15-October-2008 Status: Offline Points: 9 |
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Quarry Motors are care breakers arent they ?
You have to ask your self if you can rely on them ! If i were you i think i have to look for another garage that you know is reliable and get them to have a look. I must say i first asked a question when i saw the price for a replacement engine, it has to be a used one at that price. |
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Barry_Mc
Senior Member I Joined: 27-March-2007 Status: Offline Points: 141 |
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i've had a compression test done recently, no problems, granted they couldn't get at the 6th (near windscreen) but the rest were fine, i know every car is different but when the engine m54 2.2 in our case is the same and the problem identical i would expect the solution to be, (it seems to be a problem for the m54 engine full stop) i haven't checked the manifold for oil, so basically if the compression test is ticked off the list and with the mountain of solutions I-11 has tried its down to crankcase pressure? i'm using 5w-30 castrol edge since i bought the car nearly 2yr ago, it was burning 1ltr every 1000 - 1200 miles, prob 6mths ago after a service it started burning 1ltr every 600-700miles and now its down to 450miles, running well, see smoke at high revs alright, just a blow out if ya like, cleaning the pipes.... only problem i had with the initial service was i supplied the oil, 8ltrs, mech would always have left, left over oil in the boot, not this time, got me thinking he had put 8ltrs in, suppose i was just trying to figure out what could have been done diff....it doubled consumption after the service, is there a chance the excess caused the initial damage? Forza, whats the solution to prevent the oil access the inlet manifold? thanks for your help, i've searched this topic and there are more than 3, the engine is know for oil consumption but not 4-600miles a ltr. Barry |
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< FORZA WEST
Advanced Newbie Joined: 28-January-2008 Location: Forest of Dean,Gloucestershire Status: Offline Points: 29 |
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You need to check the cylinder compressions and also see how much oil is sat in the inlet manifold. If there is loads of oil sat in the manifold (need to remove to check ideally) then there is likely to be a high crankcase pressure and its blowing the oil out into the manifold. If thats ok then the compression test of the cylinders will show you if its coming up past the rings. The oil your putting in isnt so clever for the HVA's (hydraulic valve lifters) little bit to thick...and if any additives are used then go fo the Forte stuff as its pretty much the only add that does anything |
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Individual_11
Newbie Joined: 21-April-2008 Location: Leeds West Yorks Status: Offline Points: 10 |
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Hi Barry Well, update for you.... I tried having the breather valve replaced, no change from that. I have a long arguement with the BMW dealer which resulted in them basically saying they couldn't give a rats. The engineer did say that provided it runs well and there's no loss of power (it does and there isn't) there shouldn't be a problem as this kind of mileage is nothing for these cars. They recommended a different oil, Castrol 15W 40 High mileage. This I tried and yes it did slow down the rate of consumption but it's not a synthetic oil so would need replacing every 3000 miles. I spoke to my friend who's a vehicle technician and he thinks that oil is not so good. He's going to get me some semi synth 15-40 (trade price, so it's cheaper) to try. He had a look at the car too and is stumped, he even tested the emissions and it was ok. From what I can tell it occasionally smokes visibly at high revs (but then the exhaust is full of crap from the burned oil) but never visibly otherwise. The distance I get from a litre of oil is about the same (depending on the oil rather than the driving style) and the car does sound rough and do poor MPG when there's little oil in (but has always been sensitive to oil level). I think Uncle Kev tried one of those engine oil additives but that didn't help.... As there are now three of us I'm going to write to BMW UK. I don't expect anything other than "whatever" back from them but it's worth a go... How much oil are you using? I-11 |
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Barry_Mc
Senior Member I Joined: 27-March-2007 Status: Offline Points: 141 |
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snap individual - same engine same problem, everything down to a tee, only 3k miles behind you. it's an old post, by any chance did anyone find a solution?
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Individual_11
Newbie Joined: 21-April-2008 Location: Leeds West Yorks Status: Offline Points: 10 |
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Hi Kev I have the same/similar problem! I have an M54 2.2 and about 110k miles I had an oil service and then oil consumption shot up to a litre every 400 miles. The car has always used some oil (up to 1l every 1200 miles) but this was nuts! There are no leaks but lots of soot in the exhaust, and I've never seen much obvious smoke (except once and I suspect an overfill!). Running is smooth and power normal (except when the oil gets empty). I also get an intermittant yellow oil warning for about 10 seconds about 5 to 10 seconds after I start the engine. Everything else is normal - sounds a bit like yours from the thread! I've just had new crankcase breather/oil seperator fitted at Leeds BMW dealer (£130) as they suggested it's the place to start. I'm now running 500miles to se if I'm still using oil. Have tried several oil changes with various grades and no joy. Did once see a small amount of mayo under the filler cap but wiped this away and it never returned (so hoping it's NOT the headgasket). Like you I suspect that the engine is inducting the oil somehow and burning it through the air intake. Have you got any non standard induction (after market filter fitted) by any chance? Had the stalling problem from new - engine used to cut out when coming to a stop with the clutch in. BMW tweaked something and fixed that though... Would be interested to hear how you get on.... Will post if the breather valve has any impact (but suspect not)! Good Luck
I_11 Edited by Individual_11 |
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< FORZA WEST
Advanced Newbie Joined: 28-January-2008 Location: Forest of Dean,Gloucestershire Status: Offline Points: 29 |
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I would use a BMW specailist...Im not running yet,still stuck at dealer!!!! the reason for using a specailist is they know what to look for(or should)..A local garage may struggle depending on how good they are. The m52tu 2.3 is one for stalling-may be coz of the oil but they do like to cut out when you need to cross traffic. Fingers crossed you get a result soon. |
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